Advice needed............

[Old Account]

hi guys,

I am about to Install soon a huge system. I just wanted to make sure that I am able to install a system boiler in the celler.

Could you please tell me is I am able to fit a system boiler in there with a flue going throwing like the current one? Or would that be enough just sticking through the wall ?

I assume second option won’t work as it will need diverting correct ?

 

[ShaunCorbs]

What's the gas meter ?

 

[Old Account]

What's the gas meter ?

Good question
I have not checked it but can do tomorrow. It is a normal terraced house 3 storey plus celler.

 

[ShaunCorbs]

Good question
I have not checked it but can do tomorrow. It is a normal terraced house 3 storey plus celler.

Where is the gas meter located?

 

[Old Account]

Where is the gas meter located?

It’s a G4 meter and located inside the celler cupboard/ storage room.

About 3/4m away from the boiler

 

[Old Account]

I just wanted to find out if I can install a normal flue through the wall ? Or do I need to extend the flue like in the picture ? What would be the best option for me? I am ripping all out and install a new little plant room with a low loss header etc. I am just concerned about the flue

 

[ShaunCorbs]

What do you think also why haven't you calculated the gas load 45kw boiler takes 5m3/h hope they don't have any other appliances

 

[Old Account]

What do you think also why haven't you calculated the gas load 45kw boiler takes 5m3/h hope they don't have any other appliances

I did not calculate it because that’s not the problem they have got.

Unfortunately, they have got oven too.
The last builders didn’t know how to install the whole lot.

They have got in 3 stores ( top floor/1st floor/ groundlfoor ) full ufh and a couple of radiators installed.

Boiler isn’t capable of heating ufh neither the radiators nor ufh - it is all like warm. Boiler runs on 85c constantly.

It that’s not the point I o my wanted to find out if I can install the flue just through the wall or do I need to extend it.

If you ask me I would say diverting as the old one.

 

[Gasmk1]

is 22 mm big enough if 4 metres from boilerwith an oven as well

 

[Scott_D]

What are you fitting
What dies the manufacturer say about flue positions?

 

[ShaunCorbs]

I did not calculate it because that’s not the problem they have got.

Unfortunately, they have got oven too.
The last builders didn’t know how to install the whole lot.

They have got in 3 stores ( top floor/1st floor/ groundlfoor ) full ufh and a couple of radiators installed.

Boiler isn’t capable of heating ufh neither the radiators nor ufh - it is all like warm. Boiler runs on 85c constantly.

It that’s not the point I o my wanted to find out if I can install the flue just through the wall or do I need to extend it.

If you ask me I would say diverting as the old one.

Still doesn't matter you need to calculate the load as you could leave a dangerous appliance if the gas meter and line can't take it

Just hope all the other appliance total to less than 12kw else your boiler instal is a no go

How isn't the boiler able to heat the ufh and rads ?? turn the boiler stat down to 70 etc also did you heat loss the house to make sure 45 kw is acceptable as that might be the issue

What about different pressure zones

 

[sammathias]

The original flue does look abit excessive. Judging by the picture you have given I would say you still will need a plume kit for the new one! What I don't understand tho is how they have given the go ahead for you to start from scratch.

 

[Old Account]

is 22 mm big enough if 4 metres from boilerwith an oven as well

What are you fitting
What dies the manufacturer say about flue positions?

I will give you an exact update tomorrow what I am going to fit as I am planning what products I will use. I a, pretty sure it’s system boiler ( Vaillant ), cylinder of Vaillant, etc... precise stuff will be discussed tomorrow.

 

[sammathias]

That cylinder doesn't even look that old...they must have bottomless pockets. Looks like a decent job tho. Need to calculate the boiler size correctly tho.

 

[Old Account]

Still doesn't matter you need to calculate the load as you could leave a dangerous appliance if the gas meter and line can't take it

Just hope all the other appliance total to less than 12kw else your boiler instal is a no go

How isn't the boiler able to heat the ufh and rads ?? turn the boiler stat down to 70 etc also did you heat loss the house to make sure 45 kw is acceptable as that might be the issue

What about different pressure zones

Wow wow ,,hang on for a second, I think you misunderstand me mate.

I did not install the boiler ... I am going to change the whole installation.

The issue is that the pressure in the property drops in 24h on ufh or ch.

I have isolated both zones in turns and both drops within 24h which indicates that the leak could be caused by the old hot water cylinder. I have check the heat exchanger which is ok siphon is dry too ... no excessive condensation.

The system is clearly wrong designed.

However, I will upgrade the gas pipe if I know it’s undersized. I won’t leave my customers in a dangerous environment trust me there. I know how to run my business.

 

[ShaunCorbs]

i would say boiler is leaking if anything

and how is it designed wrongly?

gas pipe isnt the issue meter is could be

 

[sammathias]

Just looked at the photos again...am I right in saying there is a 1" and 1/2 bypass on that system???

 

[Old Account]

is 22 mm big enough if 4 metres from boilerwith an oven as well

I will upgrade the pipework to 28mm but that won’t be the problem. The system is just badly designed and not calculated properly. I only wanted to come on here to ask how to sort the flue out but instead getting criticised and questioned ...

Instead of criticism... point me in the right direction what you experienced people would check and do.

I understand where shaun is coming from and agree that the workload is important. But just guide me instead being so weird. I don’t know perhaps it’s the English way again but comes across a little weird.

 

[Old Account]

Just looked at the photos again...am I right in saying there is a 1" and 1/2 bypass on that system???

The bypass is 42mm copper

 

[Old Account]

i would say boiler is leaking if anything

and how is it designed wrongly?

gas pipe isnt the issue meter is could be

Boiler is new and not leaking checked it all. What you mean is not wrong designed? Don’t you think a low loss header should be installed ? What about the small pump shaun the pump is a joke for a property of 300m2 ... I don’t understand your questions. What you mean the meter could be an issue ?

 

[sammathias]

The bypass is 42mm copper

Would that not be an issue of things not heating?

 

[sammathias]

Boiler is new and not leaking checked it all. What you mean is not wrong designed? Don’t you think a low loss header should be installed ? What about the small pump shaun the pump is a joke for a property of 300m2 . I don’t understand your questions. What you mean the meter could be an issue ?

The boiler is 11years old? Could the leak not be the heat exchanger? I think Shaun is saying that the G4 meter is only capable to pass 6m3/h of gas ...that boiler uses 5m3/h so the additional oven appliance could bring it dangerously close to being overloaded, all on 22mm pipe.However I do think it's a system design issue.

 

[ShaunCorbs]

Boiler is new and not leaking checked it all. What you mean is not wrong designed? Don’t you think a low loss header should be installed ? What about the small pump shaun the pump is a joke for a property of 300m2 . I don’t understand your questions. What you mean the meter could be an issue ?

a low loss header of sorts is already installed and the pump is a commercial one that should be big enough, the boiler is/ was installed in 07 but if its not the issue why are you replacing it?

you have 4.4 m3/h just for the boiler (45kw) you cant go above 6m3h with your total load which leaves you around 12-13kw for you other gas appliances

what else you they have and what kw rating are they

 

[Old Account]

a low loss header of sorts is already installed and the pump is a commercial one that should be big enough, the boiler is/ was installed in 07 but if its not the issue why are you replacing it?

you have 4.4 m3/h just for the boiler (45kw) you cant go above 6m3h with your total load which leaves you around 12-13kw for you other gas appliances

what else you they have and what kw rating are they

I disagree in regards to the bypass being a low loss header. The boiler was installed not even 2 years ago that means that leak was before there too ... the customer does not want the boiler she always wanted Vaillant but the previous company said it would not work. I don’t not need such a big boiler... the customer has another gas hob but I did not check the output...
I agree in terms of the 6m3 h ... it’s definitely system problem

 

[bacon_sandwich]

In terms of the flue, i generally rely on the manufacturers data for lengths, bends, pressure drop etc. If i had any concerns i would design the flue then call the manufacturer to go through the calculations,
hope this helps