Am I ripping off an old lady?

[Blackcatgas]

Hello, the old lady from over the road called me over today. She wants a dish washer installing.The dishwasher is to be placed in the space next to the sink where the fridge was.
There is no waste provision so she needs a Mcalpine type trap with a waste inlet on it to replace the existing P trap.The cold water pipe is directly behind so just needs a washing machine valve on it.
There is one of those DIY outside tap kits with the green flexi hose connected onto the cold water pipe, this protrudes out and will stop the washing machine from going back fully,so I offerd to alter this as she was concerned.
I said £70 including bits.
Her nextdoor nieghbour thinks i should be ashamed of myself for charging that much?, its given me a complex is this too much?.

 

[REDSAW]

its disgracefull...

what if this was your own mum?.

no seriously tho, iwe dont know where you live or your hourly rate.
personally, if i liked the woman, i would charg £40 for the hour plus the parts (50).
if it took a bit longer o-hey its only over the road.

 

[Blackcatgas]

its disgracefull...

what if this was your own mum?.

no seriously tho, iwe dont know where you live or your hourly rate.
personally, if i liked the woman, i would charg £40 for the hour plus the parts (50).
if it took a bit longer o-hey its only over the road.

Cheers Redsaw, I dont feel too bad now!.
Its so easy to do things for people for ( no swearing )all.
my old boss used to say "a man that works for nothing, and a woman that f%%ks for nothing will have a job for life".

 

[33ching]

Is her next-door neighbour an expert, your the plumber so you charge what you think is a fair price. If the old dear can afford a new dishwasher then she can afford to have it plumbed in at the price you quoted. Some people I know (not just plumbers) charge OAP rates but then you get old dear "A" telling old dear "B" and then old dear "B" wants the same job done and a little bit extra for the same price. If you think it is a fair price then leave it at that and ask her next-door neighbour to get another quote.

 

[david williams]

there is a lot of this dout about what you should charge on here ,you should realise you are a buisiness,you have to make enougth to cover your costs ,vans,deisel,tools ,insurence,advertising,your savings for your pension,(you will get old) and to stay in buisiness other wise you will not be there next time she needs you

 

[secret squirrel]

I'm slowly realising that everything has a price and very rarely do things go to plan.

The extra fitting you have to use, that extra length of pipe the spare olive. That trip to the supplier on the way to the job.

As David had already said, insurance (van and liability), cost of road tax, income tax etc. It just goes on and on. I don't think £70 is excessive, its these simple jobs that your there 3 hours doing (that may be just me though).

 

[P4ULT]

na mate i dont think your ripping her off people dont seem to realise the things you need to be able to do certain jobs and time etc. i speak to a lot of others in the trade that get the same problem but if it was that easy why dont they do it themselves.

 

[david williams]

the fact is if you do not make a profit out of your work ,when bad times come you do not survive.and then your custermer has to find someone else to do the work who may not be as honest as you

 

[johnmcginty]

It is not neccesarily what the job entails either. What you charged was perfectly fine and is exactly what I would have charged. For example I have had customers say "what £50 to change a washer , that seems excessive?" though customers will never understand that plumbers overheads are excessive too. Customers will never really understand what it costs to run a business and many think that " the local plumber " will charge less than a bigger company which can be true to an extent however the local plumber will also have overheads and take home the same % Gross profit. If the customer is not happy about the price then they should ask before hand for a quote or find another plumber. This should be regardless of age or personal wealth curcumstances which would only ever confuse costings and charges and lead to a price discrimination mentality which is neither healthy for both parties and for reputation and future jobs.

 

[dontknowitall]

I did one of these earlier in the year and charged £40. Took me about an hour (plus 20 minute drive each way) and parts cost me just under £9.

I must give myself a wage rise soon.

 

[secret squirrel]

Just had a look at this thread again and want to respond to dontknowitall,

I'm trying to choose my words carefully because this is not a critism but I have problems with working out prices etc. My take on £40 with £9 costs and 1.5+ hours is about £20 per hour gross. By the time you take off expenses and costs of running a business this is probably closer to £15 per hour.

Here's my point, with the stress involved with running a business, finding work the skill involved, cost of courses, experience, the things that go wrong, dealing with customers etc. Wouldn't we be better off working for minimum wage stacking shelves......

Then the problem is good will and I'm starting out so I have to look after customers etc..

Just a quick question to anyone,

if you'd quoted a fair price for a job and it all goes T**S up and you've explained all the problems you've had, would you increase the price? OR is the price you quote fixed?

 

[johnmcginty]

This is why I only quote labour and estimate the materials. Also why so many just do an hourly rate

 

[Jimbob]

I keep finding myself doing jobs cheap for people and it really isnt worth it. Were all trying to make a living, cant be doing everything for nothing

 

[dontknowitall]

Hi Secret Squirrel

I've read your post - and the way you hoped I would! You've hit exactly the problem I'm facing - that is a new business and trying to create goodwill.

I must admit the job was for a lady of a certain age and unusually she definitely knew about prices (I did another job for her and she found the same (cheapest) price for a basin and couldn't understand why my price was more - I tried explaining something about about my supplier but didn't want to tell her the real reason was that if I bought it, the higher price was reflecting my time and petrol buying the thing for her. In the end I made her travel the 50 miles to buy it herself.

If the job goes wrong, yes, definitely charge more. But I'm careful not to quote. In theory with a quote that's your price and it shouldn't budge, up or down.

So I always give an estimate saying that if it goes better than I expect it well will be a bit cheaper and if it doesn't then it shouldn't cost more than X (which would probably be a little more than I'd quote for in the first place).

Hope this makes sense!

 

[jpm]

I personally don't want to sound callous but the "old dear"is irrelavant in this case.I tend to charge £55 for "small jobs"ie those that would take you an hour.In this particular example we have to factor in about £10 worth of materials,I would throw those in normally but bearing in mind we have not seen the job,OP may be having to dismantle sink unit for all we know,I think it's about right.£55 for me normally is £60 anyway as if you've done a tidy job people tend to give you a "pint"
my twopenneth

 

[secret squirrel]

Makes perfect sense,

Thanks for reading the post as it was intended.

 

[REDSAW]

so what your all saying, if it was your next door neighbour and you did the job at your leisure when you have nothing else on, bearing in mind no travelling and cash in pocket, you would charge the same irrespective?.

 

[jpm]

so what your all saying, if it was your next door neighbour and you did the job at your leisure when you have nothing else on, bearing in mind no travelling and cash in pocket, you would charge the same irrespective?.

Next door no,but over the road yes,we have to draw a line in the sand somewhere as you can work for nothing anywhere and you'll always be busy!I'm struggling for work right now but if I were to do jobs on the cheap for people I like(and that includes customers)I would soon be destitute,and still be busy,skint but busy.

 

[Puddle]

there is a lot of this dout about what you should charge on here ,you should realise you are a buisiness,you have to make enougth to cover your costs ,vans,deisel,tools ,insurence,advertising,your savings for your pension,(you will get old) and to stay in buisiness other wise you will not be there next time she needs you

You keep saying this,but you do not have to cover expences on an old lady across the road,who can take you plumbfix deliveries in and recorded delivery cheque payments when you are out
And keep an eye on your house when you are out at work
Is there anything called a community spirit any more

But then again if she can afford a new washing machine,she can afford £70 to put it in,if the nieghbour complains tell him when curries gives her a free washer ,I will give her free plumbing
Then I would drive her to the post office and make sure I got the money out her pension before she spends it and wastes it on heating bill credits and maybe a few cans of soup

next time

 

[traineedrip]

Its tricky.

At what point would the neighbour think the price was reasonable? You have got a business to run.

But have you lost a customer? If he puts off the lady you may have lost 2. If you look after the lady would that same neighbour be promoting you to all and sundry?

Its a tough call.

£70 for me is steep but it depends on where you are. £50-£55 and as much tea as i can drink please.

 

[david williams]

she may be just across the road ,but make a mistake its still your insurence that pays,you have no freinds in buisiness,you will be old one day if you run your buisiness as a charity ,then it will be charity you will need to live on when you are old.then you will be living on soup . i dont believe in ripping anyone off but you need to make a profit .i did not make the rules that we have to live with but if you want to be a charity thats up to you.

 

[Puddle]

she may be just across the road ,but make a mistake its still your insurence that pays,you have no freinds in buisiness,you will be old one day if you run your buisiness as a charity ,then it will be charity you will need to live on when you are old.then you will be living on soup . i dont believe in ripping anyone off but you need to make a profit .i did not make the rules that we have to live with but if you want to be a charity thats up to you.

You do make your own rules and I make mine
I run a bussiness that pays its way and because I run it well and provide a good service, it makes a nice profit,out of that I do give to charity and I believe charity begins at home
It you need the profits from a old lady across the road to keep afloat then you are running things wrong
Or just a tight old git
If you are a young plumber with a family,charge for parts
Anyway this is not about charity,its about respect for older people in the community,a thing of the past it seems
If you have insurance,you have insurance,if you do not,you do not ,it is not going to cost you any more

 

[david williams]

i have run my bussiness for forty years thank you ,and i am able to generate a good living and profit from it,older than you i might be but obviosly not as rude ,as for respect i have no problem with that either i have had some of my clients for 30 years pluss .i would not have kept them otherwise and they respect me as i them.perhaps if you lived where i do where their is a very large population of old people and you hardley charged them the going rate for your services you may soon find you were not paying your way.lack of respect for older members of the community no ,i am one.also if you have a claim on your insurence you will soon find it costing you more.i take it you are a youger plumber so you charge for parts but we older ones should not.

 

[Benfoord]

No your not ripping her off.

Her and maybe her next door neighbour in they're minds still think you can buy a car for £70

 

[electron]

Currys charge £70 for replacing, yes replacing, a dishwasher.
Just for connection that is.
Customer expected to disconnect
I think these prices are for a Built in unit though.