Cast Iron External Stack

[Aqua Mechanica]

I have to install a downstairs WC Cloakroom and need to cut a hole through the wall and boss a 4" branch into an existing black cast iron stack.

I have a few ideas but wanted to see what other's ideas were. The main two were buying a 110mm black boss and drilling a hole into the cast iron stack and the other was cutting out a section of the pipe and replace with plastic as customer won't let me replace entire stack in plastic.

Due to the fact that I normally I work on new builds, I don't usually work on occupied homes, so any advice would be helpful.

Personally, I'll love to get a diamond hole saw cutter, drill a pilot hole and use a 4" strap on boss but I am worried about the cast iron cracking whilst drilling.

 

[tackleburger]

Stap boss doesn't fit on cast properly so you will need to use one of those really stick adhesives like Plumbers Gold from everbuild. Drilling with a diamond hole saw works really well in cast that's how i do it. Timesaver make a boss for cast pipe as do polypipe I believe the latter is mechanical. Easy job with the right kit mate.

I have to install a downstairs WC Cloakroom and need to cut a hole through the wall and boss a 4" branch into an existing black cast iron stack.

I have a few ideas but wanted to see what other's ideas were. The main two were buying a 110mm black boss and drilling a hole into the cast iron stack and the other was cutting out a section of the pipe and replace with plastic as customer won't let me replace entire stack in plastic.

Due to the fact that I normally I work on new builds, I don't usually work on occupied homes, so any advice would be helpful.

Personally, I'll love to get a diamond hole saw cutter, drill a pilot hole and use a 4" strap on boss but I am worried about the cast iron cracking whilst drilling.

Mate are you on about puttinf a 4" tee in if so where does the strap boss come in. If you need to tee in. Cut the section out use two timesavers and buy a cast tee in 4". Or lead seal it properly like a real plumber!!

 

[P4ULT]

what about cutting the pipe and putting in a 4" rubber tee.

 

[justlead1]

Hi. As tackle said. Time saver, There is no playing with sockets, just cut a section out and bolt up collars. BUT before cutting make sure the stack is well supported as i have had them drop. Then a coat of black paint and it resembles a pro job. Good Luck

 

[david williams]

never put plastic below cast iron if the fixings on cast above fail and it collaspses on you or others you could even be killed

 

[Aqua Mechanica]

Another problem I have is that although it is an external stack, they have built a confined patio area and the felted roof is formed tight around stack pipe thus not allowing any movement on the pipe itself without ripping the felt roof.

Drilling and strapping on a boss is my best option, was just worried about cracking the cast.

Thanks for all the replies, much appreciated.

As for a lead seal, never done that in me life and don't suppose I ever will, lol

 

[Bernie2]

Timesaver can usually be tee'd, in between two fixed points. Have a look at their website.

 

[Aqua Mechanica]

Ok have decided to cut in a cast iron ensign branch whilst supporting the stack via extra brackets from above. Works are set out below, and I have priced at £460. My old man thinks it's not enough but then he's a roofer. What do you lot think, fair price?

Quotation​

Phase One – Rip Out
· To isolate and drain WC cloakroom, remove current WC cloakroom suite and temporarily cap off all pipes.
· Cut down existing 110mm WC outlet and seal exposed hole ready for floor tiling.
· To isolate and drain WC cloakroom radiator, remove radiator and cap pipe work other side of wall in garage.
Phase Two – Pre Plumb
· To cut 115mm hole through masonry wall ready for 110mm plastic soil branch.
· To cut in 100mm 88° cast iron branch (12 inch grinder to be hired for cutting)
· Install 110mm soil pipe work from branch to WC cloakroom ready to take pan.
· Seal WC outlet high grade mastic sealant to interior and exterior of masonry wall.
· Install Geberit Duofix WC frame and cistern 0.82m ready for boxing in and tiling.
Phase Three – 2nd Fix
· Install WC wall hung pan with soft closing cover.
· Install Push Button Flush.
· Install Wash Hand Basin ready to take vanity unit (vanity unit to be installed by carpenter).
To ensure all work areas are left in a tidy manner throughout the job and carry away any rubbish and debris.

 

[REDSAW]

Ok have decided to cut in a cast iron ensign branch whilst supporting the stack via extra brackets from above. Works are set out below, and I have priced at £460. My old man thinks it's not enough but then he's a roofer. What do you lot think, fair price?

Quotation​

Phase One – Rip Out
· To isolate and drain WC cloakroom, remove current WC cloakroom suite and temporarily cap off all pipes.
· Cut down existing 110mm WC outlet and seal exposed hole ready for floor tiling.
· To isolate and drain WC cloakroom radiator, remove radiator and cap pipe work other side of wall in garage.
Phase Two – Pre Plumb
· To cut 115mm hole through masonry wall ready for 110mm plastic soil branch.
· To cut in 100mm 88° cast iron branch (12 inch grinder to be hired for cutting)
· Install 110mm soil pipe work from branch to WC cloakroom ready to take pan.
· Seal WC outlet high grade mastic sealant to interior and exterior of masonry wall.
· Install Geberit Duofix WC frame and cistern 0.82m ready for boxing in and tiling.
Phase Three – 2nd Fix
· Install WC wall hung pan with soft closing cover.
· Install Push Button Flush.
· Install Wash Hand Basin ready to take vanity unit (vanity unit to be installed by carpenter).
To ensure all work areas are left in a tidy manner throughout the job and carry away any rubbish and debris.

have you got a waste licence then?. some one is enquiring on another thread where to get them from.lol.,

 

[Aqua Mechanica]

All the details are here mate Environment Agency - Register or renew as a waste carrier or broker

You can apply online now too

 

[david williams]

Ok have decided to cut in a cast iron ensign branch whilst supporting the stack via extra brackets from above. Works are set out below, and I have priced at £460. My old man thinks it's not enough but then he's a roofer. What do you lot think, fair price?

Quotation​

Phase One – Rip Out
· To isolate and drain WC cloakroom, remove current WC cloakroom suite and temporarily cap off all pipes.
· Cut down existing 110mm WC outlet and seal exposed hole ready for floor tiling.
· To isolate and drain WC cloakroom radiator, remove radiator and cap pipe work other side of wall in garage.
Phase Two – Pre Plumb
· To cut 115mm hole through masonry wall ready for 110mm plastic soil branch.
· To cut in 100mm 88° cast iron branch (12 inch grinder to be hired for cutting)
· Install 110mm soil pipe work from branch to WC cloakroom ready to take pan.
· Seal WC outlet high grade mastic sealant to interior and exterior of masonry wall.
· Install Geberit Duofix WC frame and cistern 0.82m ready for boxing in and tiling.
Phase Three – 2nd Fix
· Install WC wall hung pan with soft closing cover.
· Install Push Button Flush.
· Install Wash Hand Basin ready to take vanity unit (vanity unit to be installed by carpenter).
To ensure all work areas are left in a tidy manner throughout the job and carry away any rubbish and debris.

your dad is right

 

[Aqua Mechanica]

Well I thought it would take me 3 days, may go into four. What would you say was a normal price for this then David?

I forgot to add that the price I put there of £460 is labour only.

I'm so used to working as a subcontractor with a pricebook now. Hardly ever get me own jobs.

 

[david williams]

worst way for you four days,= less than £120 a day less deisel,less insurence,less your pension fund,less wear and tear on van,van tax,van insurence,how much left?? grinder hire,rubbish disposal,do you have waste transfer licence,get cought without one you could get a fine.i know it sounds mercenry but running your own buisiness you have to take all of these costs into consideration or you will not be available next year to provde your service to your custermers.

 

[Aqua Mechanica]

All makes sense, will incorperate this in future, thank you.

 

[quality]

grinder hire,.

Surley he`s got one a grinder

 

[Aqua Mechanica]

Nope, don't often use one, but if I do it's normally provided by the firm I'm contracted to.

 

[quality]

My mistake

 

[tackleburger]

You should be double that for what you are doing you will regret that price trust me. It never looks good going back after the fact to ask for more.

 

[Aqua Mechanica]

Well, the person I'm doing the work for is an old friend. I I need anything else material wise, he'll cough up but I thought the labour price was reasonable.

 

[Puddle]

Well am am not going to say to much but concealed cistern,vanity unit making easy pipe runs
Going to drill through wall for 4" for soil,grid out a section of soil and slip in a tee
you are not going to be there 4 days or 3 days
Have two pots of tea and help dad do a bit of roofing and you will still be out under two days,,,your price is ok...nice to get more if you could but hey
let us know how you get on

 

[Aqua Mechanica]

If I can do it in 2 days, all the better for the price. So you're probably right but I wanted to give myself a bit of leeway.

Will let you know the outcome ;-)

 

[justlead1]

Hi, If you have picked up the grinder and bits and pieces by 09-00 hrs and on site. I would expect the wc to be out and new hole knocked through by 11-00 hrs, cutting and inserting branch and a bit of 110 mm plastic through wall say hour and a half max. The internal side may require waiting for tilers etc to finish so it difficult to comment on. Surly plumbing training must include dealing with existing systems that are not plastic and asking clients to pay an apprentice/trainee £450 to learn how to do it is a bit strong. Personally i would be looking at a days work at £300 and get the punter to ditch the redundant material. This is not a direct swipe at you but the system that fails the trade and makes the cost of having a few plumbing alteration done for house holders cost prohibitive. Good Luck

 

[Aqua Mechanica]

Thanks for the input. I have given him a list of materials that i need and he wanted to go buy them himself and hire the equipment himself, so all I need concern myself about is completing the work and getting paid.

So I have now told him give me dayrate £120, said I predict 3 days work, just to be on the safe side.

 

[Aqua Mechanica]

This job has changed now, the stack isn't being altered.

Customer now wants me to alter the Clay soil pipe that runs underground to the drain outside. I gotta kango round it and carefully cut it back. Pain in the arse but I'm thinking is not cheap either.

Quite simply, the old loo is a old Low Level WC. Because of the projection of the flush pipe, obviously is sits a bit forward in the room. I have to move the underground outlet back maybe 150mm.