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Discuss CP12 for gas hob - gas leak investigation in the Gas Engineers Forum area at Plumbers Forums

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amarula

Hello,

I hope you will be able to give me your opinion on what follows as I am not an expert. I look after a building of 20 or so flats. A landlord called a Gas Engineer to have a CP12 issued before letting his flat. The only gas appliance we have in our flats is a gas cooker. The gas supply is communal and the communal supply point is in the car park. Pipes go up to each individual flat. The gas engineer saw a drop in pressure when doing his tests at the supply point in the kitchen. He then called the landlord to tell him he could not issue the certificate as there was a leak that he would need to investigate. He could not say where the leak was, it could be in the kitchen or it could be anywhere between the flat and the supply downstairs. I was called by the landlord to report the problem and contacted the gas engineer who told me the same. I agreed to the investigation and the cost quoted. The engineer came back the same day and went in the flat where I was shown the drop in pressure. The engineer said he did not believe the leak came from the kitchen and it must be somewhere in the building. I let him investigate the building. He reported that he pulled the washing machine behind which the pipe linking the gas hob to the supply in the kitchen was, inspected the joint but could not find a leak. This, he said, was the last area he inspected, after inspecting the building. After 2 hours, he reported he had not been able to trace the leak as he had no access to pipes within walls or ceilings. He recommended that an electric cooker be fitted. The supply was capped at the communal supply point.

I asked for a second opinion, you never know. A gas engineer came and very quickly found the leak at a joint on the pipe linking the gas hob to the supply point in the kitchen. He used a spray and there were bubbles. He repaired, tested upstairs and downstairs, checked the appliance and issued the CP12.

I would like your opinion on this - it seems common sense to me that if there is a drop in pressure indicating a leak when testing a particular appliance, any pipe relating to this appliance would be checked first before spending time investigating a building. But what is common sense for a non-expert may be different for an expert as you have information that we do not have. That is why I am asking your opinion on this matter.

Thank you.
 
Hello,

I hope you will be able to give me your opinion on what follows as I am not an expert. I look after a building of 20 or so flats. A landlord called a Gas Engineer to have a CP12 issued before letting his flat. The only gas appliance we have in our flats is a gas cooker. The gas supply is communal and the communal supply point is in the car park. Pipes go up to each individual flat. The gas engineer saw a drop in pressure when doing his tests at the supply point in the kitchen. He then called the landlord to tell him he could not issue the certificate as there was a leak that he would need to investigate. He could not say where the leak was, it could be in the kitchen or it could be anywhere between the flat and the supply downstairs. I was called by the landlord to report the problem and contacted the gas engineer who told me the same. I agreed to the investigation and the cost quoted. The engineer came back the same day and went in the flat where I was shown the drop in pressure. The engineer said he did not believe the leak came from the kitchen and it must be somewhere in the building. I let him investigate the building. He reported that he pulled the washing machine behind which the pipe linking the gas hob to the supply in the kitchen was, inspected the joint but could not find a leak. This, he said, was the last area he inspected, after inspecting the building. After 2 hours, he reported he had not been able to trace the leak as he had no access to pipes within walls or ceilings. He recommended that an electric cooker be fitted. The supply was capped at the communal supply point.

I asked for a second opinion, you never know. A gas engineer came and very quickly found the leak at a joint on the pipe linking the gas hob to the supply point in the kitchen. He used a spray and there were bubbles. He repaired, tested upstairs and downstairs, checked the appliance and issued the CP12.

I would like your opinion on this - it seems common sense to me that if there is a drop in pressure indicating a leak when testing a particular appliance, any pipe relating to this appliance would be checked first before spending time investigating a building. But what is common sense for a non-expert may be different for an expert as you have information that we do not have. That is why I am asking your opinion on this matter.

Thank you.

Seems like the first engineer went with his gut instinct, as well all do and 9 time out of 10 it does us fine. This time it has sent him in the wrong direction and he wasn't able to find the leak. This doesn't make him a bad engineer, he just gave you the best advice he could on his particular findings.

You could argue that he should have found it, but he never, as long as he left the supply capped and never charged you for work he never did he hasn't really done anything wrong.
 
Thanks Villa_Tom. Actually the gas engineer wants payment for his investigation, £260, from which he has offered to deduct the charge paid to the second engineer to find the leak, do the repair, test again, and issue a CP12. As we are disputing the charge, he has said that if we do not pay within 7 days, the full charge will be applicable.
 
without knowing the way the pipework is fitted its hard to say. Is there a gas cock and test point on entry of the gas pipe to each property? if yes then you could argue that it is easy to know if the leak is in the property or not as it can be isolated from the rest of the installation. Most engineers would spray leak detection on visable pipework around the appliance/s and meter installation before looking elsewere normally. But we all miss the obvious sometimes.
 
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