Dual flush stopped working

[JohnHarrison]

It's a Thomas Dudley Vantage (TD 212-A) dual flush. Possibly getting on for 13 years old.
I'm not a plumber but I try to solve problems myself. I found members of this forum extremely helpful some years ago when I installed a replacement Mira shower - very proud of myself! I've had to sign up again because it's been so long!
I've previously repaired this toilet flush after noticing that the 'air tubes' had become detached. It's been working fine for at least 2 years.
A few days a go the flush had stopped working & I saw that one of the tubes needed reattaching to the 'cylinder thing' (sorry, as I said, I'm not a plumber!) in the middle. I checked that the other tube & the 2 that connect to the push button were secure.
Now the button needs a few presses & some nursing to achieve a full flush.
I may need to install a whole new system in which case I'd probably try to get the same model.
Thanks in anticipation of any advice.

 

[ShaunCorbs]

Tbh with air systems best if you can to swap the whole valve as you should still be able to get yours 1/4 turn and it’s out

eg

TD Dual Flush FLUSH VALVE (Vantage) - toiletspares.co.uk

Thomas Dudley replacement dual flush pneumatic air valve for use in the Vantage concealed cistern This is the dual flush version so it has both the

www.toiletspares.co.uk

 

[JohnHarrison]

Tbh with air systems best if you can to swap the whole valve as you should still be able to get yours 1/4 turn and it’s out

eg

TD Dual Flush FLUSH VALVE (Vantage) - toiletspares.co.uk

Thomas Dudley replacement dual flush pneumatic air valve for use in the Vantage concealed cistern This is the dual flush version so it has both the

www.toiletspares.co.uk

Thanks Shaun for the quick response. Does this come with instructions & could a non-professional like me do this?

 

[ShaunCorbs]

It’s simple enough 1/4 turn one way you can tell which way with the new part then just lift the old one out after you’ve twisted It to unlock it then just put the new one in and twist back to lock in

 

[JohnHarrison]

It’s simple enough 1/4 turn one way you can tell which way with the new part then just lift the old one out after you’ve twisted It to unlock it then just put the new one in and twist back to lock in

Thanks again, Shaun. I'm taking a coffee break now & I'll pluck up the courage to see if I can remove the old valve. It's draining the water out of the cistern that could be tricky.

 

[JohnHarrison]

Hi Shaun
I closed off the water supply by turning the small screw in the inlet pipe above the valve. Then flushed & no water entered the cistern apart from about half an inch left in the bottom. I don't want to risk even this small amount of water flooding onto the floor behind the toilet.

I can either soak this up with rags or try to syphon it off with a length of hose.
I haven't ordered the new valve yet because I can see that it sits very close to the inlet pipe. Could that be a problem when trying to insert the new valve? I'm a bit scared of having to lift the inlet pipe without risking a flood. I suppose before starting the job I should turn off at the mains - the tap is close to the cistern anyway in this downstairs toilet.

 

[ShaunCorbs]

You should be fine with what’s left in

the inlet/fill valve has a tab that goes onto the back if you lift just the inlet valve up will come out of the slot

 

[JohnHarrison]

I'm very grateful for your help, Shaun & I've just ordered the flush valve. In the meantime I'll have a look at how to raise the inlet valve/pipe. The plastic fitting that holds it in place has corroded over time so it's hard to move. I've had a tentative go but didn't want to cause any damage. I think I saw a video yesterday how to do it so I'll have another look. Thanks again

 

[JohnHarrison]

I now have the new valve. I've turned the old valve & it's loose but the inlet pipe is preventing me from lifting it out. It's stuck & I can't lift it out. Here's a photo

 

[ShaunCorbs]

Wiggle a bit left and right and lift up at the same time

 

[JohnHarrison]

Wiggle a bit left and right and lift up at the same time

Eureka!!! Well, a squirt of WD40 did the trick. Thanks again Shaun. I've decided to leave the bottom part in place rather than replace it with the new one.

 

[JohnHarrison]

Eureka!!! Well, a squirt of WD40 did the trick. Thanks again Shaun. I've decided to leave the bottom part in place rather than replace it with the new one.

I see that the bottom part has got the overflow attached to it so this job is getting more complicated than I thought. I think I'll have to send for a plumber! Can't believe I installed a Mira Event shower and yet this has got me beat.
If any qualified plumbers have been following this & can finish the job then please get in touch.

 

[JohnHarrison]

By the way I live in Sandbach, Cheshire.

 

[ShaunCorbs]

Leave the overflow in place you won’t need to swap that it’s just the flush that’s causing problems

leave the cradle in and just swap the green part and new tubes etc

 

[JohnHarrison]

Leave the overflow in place you won’t need to swap that it’s just the flush that’s causing problems

leave the cradle in and just swap the green part and new tubes etc

After a short break, I've had another go & I'm trying exactly that so thanks for confirming. It's very fiddly getting the slots lined up so that the valve drops into place before I can rotate it. So I'm having a short break before trying again. Thanks again for your support.

 

[JohnHarrison]

Well, I've done it but I'm not completely happy with it. There are only 2 ways the valve will fit - 180 degrees apart - both of which cause the tubes entering the valve to get squashed against the cistern housing. The old valve was not like this. I've tested full & short flushes, both of which are not as responsive as they should be. Anyway, we'll see how it goes

 

[ShaunCorbs]

Any pictures?

 

[JohnHarrison]

Any pictures?

 

[ShaunCorbs]

Sorry of the tubes ?

 

[JohnHarrison]

Sorry of the tubes ?

I had to give my head a break from the job.
The new valve has snibs on which prevent it from rotating as far as the old one did. This meant that I could not avoid both tubes being bent at their exits against the cistern walls - restricting airflow. The full flush, however, was excellent but not the short flush.[The push button unit had a broken piece & was loose so I bought a new one & installed it.]
I knew I had to rotate the valve so that the tubes were not squashed but it's only today that I've had the confidence to tackle this. Using a pair of grips I loosened the large plastic nut underneath (had to put a mirror underneath to see)until I could rotate the valve. The tubes are now free. But even after tightening the nut, there is a leak - I tested with a small amount of water in the cistern after putting lots of towels under. There's another nut (more rounded shape) which may resolve the the leak but it wouldn't turn
Now I'm a stuck again so I've contacted a plumber but they've not got back to me yet. So everything looks ready for test apart from the leak. Here are some photos.

 

[ShaunCorbs]

Is it leaking when there’s water in the cistern or when flushed ?

 

[moonlight]

Take it back out and put it back in the same position as the old one was in, always tight. Did you check the button first?