Firebird Low Box Boiler

[tickdoc]

Good evening do any of you have any experience of the new firebird low nox boilers with eclo. Never seen 1 before but went to commission it. The co2 is meant to be 12.5 with a conventional flue. This boiler had a balanced flue with a plume kit fitted and the top bend that points the plume away from the wall wasn't fitted, not sure how important that is. The oil pressure was just under 10 , the book says 9.8 . The closest I could get to 12.5 was unfortunately 11.6 . As soon as I adjusted the air any less it was starting to burn dirty. The co was 36ppm. Anyone got any ideas and what's the closest I can get away with, I'm thinking 12.3 .

 

[SimonG]

What it says in the book and what it needs in reality are totally different.

 

[Gazzt]

Firebird low Nox burners are set to the ambient temperature. You take the outside air temp and on top of the burner there is a chart to tell you what to set the co2 at. Is it the new elco burner?

 

[oilmark]

I wouldn't leave above 12% no matter what the book says. Recipe for soot.

 

[tickdoc]

I wouldn't leave above 12% no matter what the book says. Recipe for soot.

Yes it's the new elco, I set it to 11.9

 

[Gazzt]

The elco burner will only start to soot at 14 - 15per cent co2. 11.9 is fine. @ 10c outside temperature.

 

[Gazzt]

Elco burners are called light blue flame. The blast tube is designed to recirculate gases inside the combustion chamber, giving you a very clean burn. I have seen it working at Firebird training days. It is a very good burner.

 

[Gazzt]

 

[Gazzt]

View attachment 35715

From elco burner manual

 

[SJB060685]

@Gazzt my understanding of the new low nox burners is like you say the blast tube is designed to recirculate flue gasses, what this does is reduce the temperature of the flame lowering the nox levels. This is just one of a few ways burner manufacturers can lower the nox levels, unfortunately there’s very little we as engineers can do to influence the final nox emissions. Am I right? As for setting up the CO2 I’ve always set up accordingly to outside temperature as the graph you showed suggests.

 

[Gazzt]

Good evening do any of you have any experience of the new firebird low nox boilers with eclo. Never seen 1 before but went to commission it. The co2 is meant to be 12.5 with a conventional flue. This boiler had a balanced flue with a plume kit fitted and the top bend that points the plume away from the wall wasn't fitted, not sure how important that is. The oil pressure was just under 10 , the book says 9.8 . The closest I could get to 12.5 was unfortunately 11.6 . As soon as I adjusted the air any less it wa

Good evening do any of you have any experience of the new firebird low nox boilers with eclo. Never seen 1 before but went to commission it. The co2 is meant to be 12.5 with a conventional flue. This boiler had a balanced flue with a plume kit fitted and the top bend that points the plume away from the wall wasn't fitted, not sure how important that is. The oil pressure was just under 10 , the book says 9.8 . The closest I could get to 12.5 was unfortunately 11.6 . As soon as I adjusted the air any less it was starting to burn dirty. The co was 36ppm. Anyone got any ideas and what's the closest I can get away with, I'm thinking 12.3 .

Hi the co2 is set according to outside air temperature. As long as the co is below 50ppm. The boiler adjustments are best set with the flue temperature over 60 degrees.

 

[Gazzt]

Yes really all you can do is set the co2 levels, you can't do much about Nox emissions.

 

[Gazzt]

I have commissioned quite a few new Firebirds with the low Nox elco. Never had any bother with sooting up. You can leave them air rich if unhappy with readings.

 

[Gazzt]

Is it not the new riello low Nox on Grant boilers that have to be set to 12.5 C02

 

[SJB060685]

Looking at the Grant low nox burner manuals it is 12.5% CO2 yes. Have not had the pleasure of the Firebird Elco yet

 

[SJB060685]

The Grant Blu Flame burner manual I’m looking at suggests 12% CO2 though. Either way wether it’s low nox yellow flame or the Blu flame 12% CO2 is achievable, whereas as you know many older burners would soot up just knowing you set it to 12%+ lol

 

[Gazzt]

The elco is quite a good burner.

 

[Gazzt]

If you leave them 3- 5 % on the air rich side you can't go far wrong. I would leave a Firebird condensing boiler air rich around 11%C02 with the old rdb burner.

 

[SJB060685]

That’s the thing. Each installation is different, boiler design, flue type and length etc etc all affect wether it soots. You come to learn what each individual boiler likes to run at.