Ideal HE24 LF error - yet again!

[Idealhater]

I know this must be one of the commonest problems but I seem to have a new twist which someone might be able to explain. I get the LF error typically when starting up in the morning. I've checked all the usual things - ignition, condensate drain etc. Nothing. Changing from a simple timer plus room thermostat to a programmer reduced the frequency of failure by allowing the boiler to fire a couple of times overnight and so reduce the off time. But that's not addressing the problem.

And then after going through the reset cycle several times I removed the inner cover and reset again to see what was going on. It started instantly, though I hadn't done anything. Since then every time it fails I just remove the cover, reset and replace the cover straight away - it works every time, but why???? Today I even reset with the cover on, watched as it failed to ignite on the first and second tries, whipped off the cover and sure enough on its third try it fired.

It makes no sense to me - can anyone give me a clue?

( I know some of the ignition wiring runs close to the cover seal and screws but there is no sign of anything getting trapped. )

 

[villa_tom]

You need a GSE in to have a thorough look at the internal parts of your boiler. Could be one of man faults on this boiler, best to have it checked over by a qualified person.
unfortunately you have a poor boiler fitted, and problems are quite common with these.
does it make a loud banging noise when it eventually fires up?

 

[Idealhater]

No - when it fires it's perfectly smooth and quiet then runs well until the next failure. With the new programmer it now runs for a week or more between failures and it takes only a minute to restart so it could be worse.

I now know the HE24 is rubbish but no one told me before fitting. You don't need to be a heating engineer to see that positioning the electronics under a leak prone automatic air vent is not clever!

Unfortunately I have 2 of the damn things ( its a rambling sort of house ) - last winter both were out at the same time. No one round here will touch them, including the firm that fitted them. Fortunately Ideal's call out was pretty efficient - they must get a lot of practice. For a fixed price they replaced what looked like half the internals. Yet 18 months later here we go again....

 

[quality]

You need a gas safe registered engineer to have a look, we all know they are not the best boiler but they are easy to fix especially LF flame failure fault

 

[Brendan Rodgers]

Mate, as a kind of IDEAL engineer i would get somebody in who will garuntee ther visit,, try and get it on a maintanace contract as it could be ia intermitenent faualt with,, V9 PCB, GASVALVE,SPARK GEN, and V9 pcbs are not cheep.
Has the dynamic working presure at the metre or at the boiler been checked?
Check the white pipe to the gasvalve has got nothing in it, has it had a water leak inside the combustion chamber?
good luck,

Brendan.

 

[Idealhater]

Thanks for the replies. Obviously I will need to get an engineer in - I wouldn't dream of fiddling with anything but the obvious stuff myself. Though as I said before no one round here will touch them, I have to go back to Ideal itself. They used to do a fixed price repair - I think it was around £200 per boiler. Considering the time the engineer was here plus the number of parts he replaced ( including PCBs ) I think it must have cost them. Maybe that's why I can't find any reference to fixed price call out on there web site today!
To be honest I may just call it a day and replace the boiler with something reliable. Its about 8 years old which from what I read is a pretty good lifetime for this model. I've also read recently that the claimed 90% efficiency is nowhere near delivered in practice. My £2000+ a year gas bill would suggest so.
It would have been nice to resolve the mystery of why just undoing 4 screws and removing a cover is enough to restart the boiler but never mind.......

 

[Brendan Rodgers]

Thanks for the replies. Obviously I will need to get an engineer in - I wouldn't dream of fiddling with anything but the obvious stuff myself. Though as I said before no one round here will touch them, I have to go back to Ideal itself. They used to do a fixed price repair - I think it was around £200 per boiler. Considering the time the engineer was here plus the number of parts he replaced ( including PCBs ) I think it must have cost them. Maybe that's why I can't find any reference to fixed price call out on there web site today!
To be honest I may just call it a day and replace the boiler with something reliable. Its about 8 years old which from what I read is a pretty good lifetime for this model. I've also read recently that the claimed 90% efficiency is nowhere near delivered in practice. My £2000+ a year gas bill would suggest so.
It would have been nice to resolve the mystery of why just undoing 4 screws and removing a cover is enough to restart the boiler but never mind.......

Removing the cover makes it light, your ignition lead is shorting out on it or you,v got a flue/fan problem, more than likley the ignition lead.
The one off payment is about £250-£300 and it covers the boiler for 12 months, i have heard of one for about £200 and covered for 30 dayss but not shure if its still in force..
good luck,

Brendan.

 

[SimonJohns]

Removing the cover makes it light, your ignition lead is shorting out on it or you,v got a flue/fan problem, more than likley the ignition lead.
The one off payment is about £250-£300 and it covers the boiler for 12 months, i have heard of one for about £200 and covered for 30 dayss but not shure if its still in force..
good luck,

Brendan.

Edit. Removed.

 

[Idealhater]

Brendan - you're right about the fixed price. I think I paid £240 or thereabouts 2 years ago and it did cover 12 months. But it doesn't seem to be available from Ideal anymore. In fact their website doesn't seem to have anything about engineer call out except under warranty. I'll maybe give them a ring.

 

[bengasman]

I can think of at least half a dozen different reasons why this fault appears varying from just need for a real service (strip down, not just a probe in the flue and a wipe with a cloth ), down to a write off due to costs being more than the boiler is worth ( which, admittedly, is not a whole lot ).
With these, it is usually a combination of a crap boiler to start with, and a crap installer to make the disaster complete.
Either a fixed price repair from Ideal ( around £300 - £500 these days, depending ) or find a good local repair specialist who knows these abortions.

 

[dancinplumba]

I can think of at least half a dozen different reasons why this fault appears varying from just need for a real service (strip down, not just a probe in the flue and a wipe with a cloth ), down to a write off due to costs being more than the boiler is worth ( which, admittedly, is not a whole lot ).
With these, it is usually a combination of a crap boiler to start with, and a crap installer to make the disaster complete.
Either a fixed price repair from Ideal ( around £300 - £500 these days, depending ) or find a good local repair specialist who knows these abortions.

spoken with eloquence, knowledge and experience.
imho

 

[smileyplumber]

i had a similar problem with an Idea couple years back and it turned out to be loose paint flaking off inside the flue pipe causing enough drag to stop boiler fire up when case was on it may not be that but its worth a look by your engineer

 

[smileyplumber]

I had a similar fault with an Ideal boiler couple years back turned out to be paint flaking off the inside of the flue pipe causing enough drag to stop firing up when the case was fitted

 

[quality]

I can think of at least half a dozen different reasons why this fault appears varying from just need for a real service (strip down, not just a probe in the flue and a wipe with a cloth ), down to a write off due to costs being more than the boiler is worth ( which, admittedly, is not a whole lot ).
With these, it is usually a combination of a crap boiler to start with, and a crap installer to make the disaster complete.
Either a fixed price repair from Ideal ( around £300 - £500 these days, depending ) or find a good local repair specialist who knows these abortions.

Good post post that is fella, I put an Icos in my mothers about 2006 ish and it has not missed a beat, but if everybody replaced their rubbish boiler where would my wages come from lol.

 

[smileyplumber]

I had a similar fault with an Ideal boiler couple years back turned out to be paint flaking off the inside of the flue pipe causing enough drag to stop firing up when the case was fitted

why did i post twice and how come they different ?