Jobs that have gone wrong, massively..

[varial]

Hey,

Been working for myself and in my 3rd year now, has it ups and downs but lately been flat out doing 1 bathroom after the other. I have had problems in the past but only little things which take 2 seconds to tighten or fix and you think 'bloody hell how did i miss that'. But this job..... this job has gone wrong so bad! I basically need to take the shower cubicle out, tiles off wall, tray out take stud wall down and re-do it all from scratch.

Its really knocked my confidence and unfortunately a chippy is working at the same house and it was him who discovered the problem, i thought i knew how to fix the problem but he also told me he had the same problem years ago and that it all needs re-doing (kinda made me feel better knowing he had same problem)... I cant help feeling like a 'cowboy' or some thing though. The only thing i can say to myself is that this is the first balls up i have had and im going around first thing tomorrow to correct it all and i almost feel like giving some kind of refund but im gonna end up spending a few bob of my own money re-doing it for them.

Suppose im just wanting to hear your stories so i don't feel so depressed and like im the only one who has messed up like this!

 

[gassafe]

You didnt actually say what had gone so wrong with the job...

Everyone makes mistakes tho i guess, were all only as good as are last c##k up!!

I think the main thing is to admit you made a mistake, and then do all you can to rectify it like you are doing. I wouldent feel the need to offer a refund, your time and materials in re-doing the job is lesson learnt! Just gotta carry on some times and hope the next job is abit easier =]

 

[WaterTight]

..out of interest what did you do wrong?

everyone messes up, everyone learns by their mistakes. the bigger the job the bigger the potential mistake. if you just fix toilets and change taps - apart from the dreaded push-fit fitting blowing off while people are on hols - there's not so much too go wrong, touch wood.

 

[varial]

I basically tiled onto some plywood after sealing it with PVA, Some cracks have appeared in the grout which let water leak behind.

 

[kimbo]

I always think the mark of a good tradesman apart from doing a good job is going back on the job to correct his mistakes and not fob the customer off.

 

[GasmanxxxR1]

In the grand scheme of things this is not a massive cock up mate,

 

[leelister6]

A decent thickness of marine ply, well screwed down, unibonded and tiled should be sound as long as you let the adhesive go off properly (2 days minimum) before grouting. I've tiled straight onto unibonded plasterboard before and not had a problem but if the customer will pay for it, I would definitely go for the aquapanel in showers.

 

[varial]

I always think the mark of a good tradesman apart from doing a good job is going back on the job to correct his mistakes and not fob the customer off.

Cant agree more, but i should of done it right in the first place... having said that i didn't know i was doing it wrong. Learned a hard lesson but one which will stick with me! Going to put backer board on the problem wall and re-do it all. I just feel bad for the customer who has been nothing but nice to me about the whole thing!

 

[WaterTight]

Well that's a GOOD thing. Imagine how much worse this would have been if it was a customer who was a ratty, humourless, nosey, know-it-all? When a job goes wrong and I've an understanding and nice customer I always count that as a huuuge blessing.

 

[Guest123]

Happens to everyone mate. Lucky for you your customer seems understanding. At least you're going back to make amends. EVERYONE makes mistakes, you'll learn from the experience and will pick yourself up and put this bad experience behind you.

Remember in this trade, every day is a school day and no matter how old you are, you are always learning.

 

[secret squirrel]

Cant agree more, but i should of done it right in the first place... having said that i didn't know i was doing it wrong. Learned a hard lesson but one which will stick with me! Going to put backer board on the problem wall and re-do it all. I just feel bad for the customer who has been nothing but nice to me about the whole thing!

The reason the customer is being good about it is because your doing the right thing. No excuses, hands up, I'm sorry, I made a mistake. The customer will not expect a refund nor should you offer one. The only thing the customer will care about is it being sorted, promptly and correctly. The fact that you feel so bad about it makes the customer feel happier about it as well.

Its frustrating more than anything so, don't worry about it, just as you and everyone else has said, just learn from it.

 

[varial]

The reason the customer is being good about it is because your doing the right thing. No excuses, hands up, I'm sorry, I made a mistake. The customer will not expect a refund nor should you offer one. The only thing the customer will care about is it being sorted, promptly and correctly. The fact that you feel so bad about it makes the customer feel happier about it as well.

Its frustrating more than anything so, don't worry about it, just as you and everyone else has said, just learn from it.

Aye its a good thing i have a conscience but gets to me that i have done a bad job!

Been a while since i saw u btw

 

[Gray0689]

I have seen plenty of jobs tilled on to ply with no problems why do you have to rip it all out????

 

[bill577]

I have seen plenty of jobs tilled on to ply with no problems why do you have to rip it all out????

I was just thinking the same thing as I read through the thread, why do you think its all gotta come out ?

 

[dontknowitall]

When I worked in an office in the City, I made a serious mistake and as soon as I realised, I went to my boss, apologised, explained what the mistake was and apologised again. He thanked me for being open about it and said that the person who doesn't make mistakes isn't trying hard enough.

Like others who've said before, I'd leave out the refund part. What I've done in the past is bought a small present (e.g. nice packet of biscuits, or a couple of pot plants.) Only spent around £10 (and put it against my expenses for Mr. Taxman.) A small gift is much cheaper than a financial refund and is often remembered for longer.

 

[royston]

As others have said, if someone says they dont make mistakes no matter how long theve been in the game, are telling pork pies. The main thing is to take a step back, deep breath and start again if you have to. Its horrible knowing that you might have done the job for nothing in the end, but at least the job is done right and the customer will/should appreciate that. Move on to the next job knowing youve learnt something. Chin up.

 

[stevetheplumber]

the man who never made a mistake never made anything
just put it down to experience customers are usually happy to get it sorted i wouldnt offer a refund as youve admitted your mistake and your willing to put it right

 

[Phil]

If you go on the tilers forum you pick up all sorts of tips and find that wood isn't a good surface to tile on and PVA must not be used in any circumstances only a proper tile primer.

PVA is for plasterers, not tilers although in the past I've used it before I knew any better.

 

[dontknowitall]

I've been to two tiling shops recently and asked for some sort of primer and they both said use pva! Despite what the tilers forum says, I've never had a problem with pva. Maybe using a tile primer is a little one upmanship and makes you look more professional? Wouldn't surprise me if it's pva in a differently marked tin!

 

[LegionellaSlave]

Hey,

Been working for myself and in my 3rd year now, has it ups and downs but lately been flat out doing 1 bathroom after the other. I have had problems in the past but only little things which take 2 seconds to tighten or fix and you think 'bloody hell how did i miss that'. But this job..... this job has gone wrong so bad! I basically need to take the shower cubicle out, tiles off wall, tray out take stud wall down and re-do it all from scratch.

Its really knocked my confidence and unfortunately a chippy is working at the same house and it was him who discovered the problem, i thought i knew how to fix the problem but he also told me he had the same problem years ago and that it all needs re-doing (kinda made me feel better knowing he had same problem)... I cant help feeling like a 'cowboy' or some thing though. The only thing i can say to myself is that this is the first balls up i have had and im going around first thing tomorrow to correct it all and i almost feel like giving some kind of refund but im gonna end up spending a few bob of my own money re-doing it for them.

Suppose im just wanting to hear your stories so i don't feel so depressed and like im the only one who has messed up like this!

Dont be depressed lad.
Cant blame you for being pee'd off though mate.
Good luck with the fix and keep yer chin up kid

:grouphug:

 

[Phil]

There's pages and pages of threads on the tilers forum (of which I'm a member) that explains how PVA becomes 'reactivated' when in contact with wet adhesive and leads to tiles debonding.

Its seems though a lot of builders and plumbers are still using PVA, when a tiler here's of someone using it, they react the same as plumbers would if we saw a diyer fitting a Speedfit gas pipe or something like that.

There's a hell of a lot more to tiling than you may think, the main no no's are don't use tubbed adhesive, don't tile on plywood, don't tile on chipboard, dont use PVA and dont dot and dab adhesive (5 blobs).

Also when using 6mm Hardiebacker on floors, the boards must be fixed onto flexible powered adhesive, screwed and the joins taped before tiling. The adhesive is to fill any voids. Its an expensive way to do it as rapid set is not cheap but its piece of mind, you cant use driwall adhesive either as its not flexible and will void the gaurantee on the cement boards

I joined the tilers forum when I had a tiled floor fail and I was stressed big time as the customer was a nasty piece of work, the floor tiles were cracking over the joins in the 12mm plywood which I had laid over the floorboards. The guys on the tiler forum told me never to tile on 12mm ply and that the British Standard is 15mm, But who sells 15mm ply? No one so go up to 18mm.
I was advised to use 12mm back when I started and would have carried on using it had I not had any problems.

When I tile a floor now I rip up the floorboards and add noggins to make a grid layout on the floor, then glue and screw 18mm WBP ply onto joists after priming the edges, underside and face (to stop it absorbing moisture underneath), then 6mm Hardiebacker and then tiles.

Only then can I sleep easy knowing I won't get that dreaded call.

 

[H2ODAN]

Some usefull info here lads. Out of interest, going back to the bathroom wall, would i nail the plasterboard onto the ply? Then tile onto the ply correct?

 

[Phil]

Did you rip everything out today Varail?

I'd be interested to know what it was like behind the tiles, was the adhesive combed on or did you dot & dab?

What was the reason for the ply in the first place if you don't mind me asking?

:coffee:

 

[Guest123]

Excellent and very informative post you made Phil. I've always used 12mm ply, but now you've made me think!

 

[varial]

I took the tiles off the plywood today and the adhesive had failed to set properly behind the tiles where the grout had cracked for obvious reasons. only about 2 tiles actually had this problem but i took the whole lot of and then screwed hardibacker board onto the plywood and proceeded to re-tile. Hopefully this should solve all my problems and i can move on having learnt a lesson!