Lost control..?l

[Ted808]

Hi Guys,
I had a customer call me up, he says
'when I turn the room stat down by a significant amount- 23-15deg, the boiler locks out. This has happened every time'
Now I'm not being funny but what could it be? Is it just he's not used to his system (recently moved in there) or is it a real fault.
I have not had much experience in fault finding on controls and am keen to improve. I have used a multimeter a few time but.... How do I go about solving this problem, if it is one.
I must add also that this fella seems to be milking me fo answers without wanting to pay. He's had a few questions and when I try to press him for fault dianoses time+payment he just answers with more questions.
There's my second question- How do I price fault finding?
It's tricky because I am just starting out on my own and it feels like there's a lot I don't know, besides the plumbing stuff.
Cheers for any advice.
Really enjoy this forum, the chat and banter and the real good advice, feel like it's a panel of big DADDIES taking care of business. lol
:coolgleamA::coolgleamA::shades_smile:imp2::stooge_moe::coolgleamA:

 

[Puddle]

First port of call to check is how the pump is operating on the system

Maybe boiler going to lock out as over heating due to pump shutting down also when room stat turned off ,instead of having a over run period

Or a by pass on the system is not open or non existent

Basically look at possible hot water distribution problem once room stat turned down

Imho

 

[diamondgas]

Hi ted808

First thing I'd want to know is what type of system design are you dealing with and the make and model of the boiler. From there you can eliminate possibilities! take it one step at a time, work out what you'd expect to be happening against what is actually occurring. Turning a room stat down does several sorts of thing all associated with instructing the system that the central heating has now reached temperature and is no longer required. On a combi that usually means shut down to standby; 'y'plan the stat moves the diverter valve to mid position nothing more, & 's'plan the r/stat supplies power to the heating zone valve motor, on a gravity system it turns the pump on and off

If the boiler is locking out you need to know why? Most likely suspect would be overheating I'd imagine but without more info you couldn't say..

Pricing wise I'd suggest giving the custard an hourly rate/call out charge! Once you've diagnosed the fault then you can better let them know any additional costs should a further visit and or parts be required

 

[Millsy 82]

To me it sounds like a 2 port valve shutting off and bypass not open enough or not there but could also could be pump overun not wired in.

As to the customer sounds like he wants you to tell him whats wrong over the phone so he can fix it himself I am now pretty blunt and vague when the customers fishing for the answer.

I would tell him that it needs further investigation as there is only so much you can do over the phone (top up pressure yes most other things no you dont want something to go wrong and he says I was just doing what you said) give him your hourly charge then tell him when you can go round. If he still asks more questions say sorry but cant help you any further over phone if you would like me to call in give me a call

 

[Ted808]

Hi Guys,
Thanks for all the advice. Funny how when I said to the fella there maybe more than one problem. I would gladly come around to fault find for a reasonable fee. I've not heard from him again... ah well maybe I shoulda done it for free? 'to gain the fault finding experience?'

 

[Ted808]

Hi diamondgas
It is a system boiler-BAXI-in a outside compartment. Vented cylinder 210l on the 1st floor, usual cold tankin the loft + F+E tank. Heatining= about 9-11 rads. I went to look just to asses if his request for an UVHWC could be installed. Now I realise there was a lot more I shoulda taken in. LEARNING

 

[secret squirrel]

Hi Guys,
Thanks for all the advice. Funny how when I said to the fella there maybe more than one problem. I would gladly come around to fault find for a reasonable fee. I've not heard from him again... ah well maybe I shoulda done it for free? 'to gain the fault finding experience?'

NO, you shouldn't do it for free, explain there is a charge, whatever your charge is, this customer is a time waster and I wouldn't worry but it is annoying. I will fault find for free providing I get the job but I make it clear that there is a charge.

If you don't charge you'll fault find and explain to him how to do it, he'll say I'll let you know and never will.....

 

[Ted808]

Hey Guess what? I stuck to my guns and told this guy that i would fault find for a fee.. And two weeks later he got in touch and requesting me to find the problem!
So it payed to stick to my guns no matter how pressured i felt.
Will be refreshing my memory on system layouts n writing a systematic check list.

Thanks :rockon:

 

[Ted808]

Hi guys an update....
Been there yesterday, and had a good look around ..
Like I said B4 it's a Gravity system- Baxi 30HE, Alpha (digi pump on 2), 2X 2 port valves,
(1050) HWC-set to 65~c, Big OLD CWSC and F+E tank, 12 rads.
2 bathrooms- towel rails-one on AND one-OFF!- guy said bathroom was getting too hot, so he shut the valves..here's the problem me thinks..he's shut the by-pass, SO this could be why his boiler locks out when he turns the room stat DOWN-YES?
But now the lockshields-fairly crudded won't open.. well i didn't want to try very hard cuz it was just a fault finding mission. BUT also while I was there, the F+E tank vent started spouting hot water... IS THIS ALSO CUZ THE BY-PASS SHUT_YES??

To me it sounds like a 2 port valve shutting off and bypass not open enough or not there but could also could be pump overun not wired in.

Alpha pump at boiler does turn off when I turned stat down after about 2 min-OK...? So the overun is wired in ?

The 2 TPV's seem to be operating but not quite sure how to test if there's a fault.
Had HW on one valve opened, had CH+HW on other valve opened, they also had resistance when closed... Was this the right way to check?
Anyway will appreciate your advice.....
-----Can you get a decent shower off a gravity system, the head is about 4-6foot, CWSC is raised. At the mo' they got a shower mixer bath tap and ...well... it's not going to work!! EVER! I think he's looking at electric or power shwr ?
Lastly, the thing with the pump was a pie in the sky, it's not connected!!!
I do like a bit of problem solving, with a little help from my 'friends' ...get me rusty bits going again...
Thanks for listening :1eye: