Overflow challenge!

[jimbo2112]

Hi All,

We have an overflow that is driving us to distraction. It's been pushing water out sporadically for years and we cannot get to the bottom of it. I"m looking for a plumber that has enough experience to look at this and understand the fix. We've had many plumbers look at it and scratch their heads, so consider it a challenge please!

Below is the situation:

• It's not a dodgy ballcock
• The water is coming up from below, not from the pipes overhanging the hot and cold water tanks
• The tanks are in the attic
• We have a hot water cylinder upstairs
• We have a twin shower pump (I noticed this was shooting a fine jet of water from it before, but not seen it since
• We get water hammer from air in the system(?)
• Most taps are either fully hot or fully cold
• Cold tap in the main bathroom goes hot before going cold (hot water in system or hot against cold pipe somewhere?)
• The overflow does not leak 24/7 and for some months of the year, not at all
• If we don't use enough water everyday, the overflow is currently spewing out

While we are looking for a fix, we don't want to rip out the system to find a solution which would have cost £50, so I'd really appreciate the expert analysis here! We are based near Watford if anyone fancies coming to have a look?

Thanks

Jimbo

 

[SimonJohns]

If there is any mixer taps in your house put a check valve on the pipes.

The water is back flowing now and again. It happens

 

[PlumbBobBob]

If there is any mixer taps in your house put a check valve on the pipes.

The water is back flowing now and again. It happens

i agree

 

[galaxy_plumbing]

also check for blocked shower heads. had this before, left tap on but blocked shower head was pushing water into tank.

 

[jimbo2112]

If there is any mixer taps in your house put a check valve on the pipes.

The water is back flowing now and again. It happens

Would this happen even if the mixer tap (in the kitchen) was not used?

 

[jimbo2112]

also check for blocked shower heads. had this before, left tap on but blocked shower head was pushing water into tank.

The shower flows very well so probably not that?

 

[SimonJohns]

The shower flows very well so probably not that?

If your such a good plumber why are you asking our advice.

If one of us was at your house we could give a more accurate answer.

I'm sorry if I've offended you. But your the one with the problem and your questioning our advice

 

[jimbo2112]

Thatmks for the replies so far, but, what do you think about the other issues? Could they be a part of it, or just coincidental?

 

[Ermintrude]

The headder tank feeding cylinder is some times connected to cold tap on bath or shower, to ensure supply's are balanced. Some times when changing bathrooms mains cold grts connected to mixer tap . Or as said by others a shower or power shower. Perhaps a non return valve on hot and cold on mixer and shower? Did the problem start shortly after bathroom works?

 

[jimbo2112]

If your such a good plumber why are you asking our advice.

If one of us was at your house we could give a more accurate answer.

I'm sorry if I've offended you. But your the one with the problem and your questioning our advice

Not at all, that was a real question. If the shower head was blocked then I would have said it was worth checking, but I was asking if the shower head could still be an issue if it was flowing well? I know virtually nothing about plumbing.

 

[Ermintrude]

Not at all, that was a real question. If the shower head was blocked then I would have said it was worth checking, but I was asking if the shower head could still be an issue if it was flowing well? I know virtually nothing about plumbing.

May be a fault inside shower mixer? U could test, turn off shower, isolate water supplies. Leave it for a few days and if dropping overflow is no more .......... Obviously u would need to make prior arrangements for washing?

 

[jimbo2112]

The headder tank feeding cylinder is some times connected to cold tap on bath or shower, to ensure supply's are balanced. Some times when changing bathrooms mains cold grts connected to mixer tap . Or as said by others a shower or power shower. Perhaps a non return valve on hot and cold on mixer and shower? Did the problem start shortly after bathroom works?

It's hard to pin down when it started. It may well have started after we got the kitchen done, we've not had any bathroom works done, but I think there may have been a mixer tap in the previous kitchen as well. The problem is it might stop for 3 or 4 months and then start up again. Really infuriating!

The non-return valve additions sound like a fairly inexpensive fix to try though? What would be the cost to do that work do you think?

 

[jimbo2112]

May be a fault inside shower mixer? U could test, turn off shower, isolate water supplies. Leave it for a few days and if dropping overflow is no more .......... Obviously u would need to make prior arrangements for washing?

Family with 2 kids so that is not an option unless we go away for a few days and ask the neighbour to have a look avery now and again. If I don't get it fixed then that 's a good test. Thanks.

 

[phil the bucket]

My guess is there is a cross connection some where ie cold connected it to hot somewhere in the house

 

[jimbo2112]

Is there anyone on this thread local to Watford that could come and take a closer look sometime?

 

[Ermintrude]

Non returns cheap but they would need to be suited to gravity feed.

 

[Reg Man]

Reading the first post. Your plumbing system sounds like a dogs dinner. Get an independent survey done of your plumbing system with recommendations for a way forward.

 

[jimbo2112]

Reading the first post. Your plumbing system sounds like a dogs dinner. Get an independent survey done of your plumbing system with recommendations for a way forward.

OK, but who would carry that out for me? Any recommendations?

 

[Reg Man]

OK, but who would carry that out for me? Any recommendations?

Depends on where you are and if you can to terms with my rates. I might have some contacts in your area who might be able help. Just need to PM me with your area if you don't want it public.

 

[sputnick]

Is the F&E tank a bit higher than the cold water tank if so there may be a pin hole in the coil on cylinder and the water is filling the storage tank and overflowing. I've had this happen once and took ages to find, Arrrrrrggg lol

 

[Chalked]

Is the F&E tank a bit higher than the cold water tank if so there may be a pin hole in the coil on cylinder and the water is filling the storage tank and overflowing. I've had this happen once and took ages to find, Arrrrrrggg lol

My thoughts too.

 

[stevetheplumber]

i would start by looking at the kitchen mixer as its the one thing thats changed since this started for you system it should be a biflow mixer

 

[BLOD]

Does your washing machine have hot & cold feeds ?

 

[Best]

Always a good idea to use a torch to take a look inside the cwt at the tank fittings connections. If you see a slight haze coming up one of them, it will be the feed to the cylinder with hot water entering upwards to the cold tank normally. Trouble is the cause can then be several things, - mixer taps, shower mixers, pumps, or, sometimes cylinder coil failure. And I would check in that order more or less, except the cylinder coil which should simply be a matter of checking if highest tank if filling to lowest.