Please help me diagnose these drips and condensating pipes!

[PleaseHelp]

Hi everyone,

Complete novice here. I have water droplets leaking from the ceiling in both of my flat's bedrooms. It's coming from the exact same spot in both bedrooms, which is in the gap below where I believe the heating/air-circulation systems are located in the ceiling of each room (see pics below, the water is dripping from the black circled areas).

We do not have radiators, only fan heating from the ceiling vents which also has a "comfort cool" fan setting. The water is leaking whether or not the system is turned on in the room.

In the utility cupboard, some of the pipes are condensating so badly that huge puddles are forming. The floor feels so cold and some of the pipes are almost freezing cold to touch. I've put a picture below; the pipe above the towel is the worst offender.

Anyone have any tips or suggestions as to what this could be? Is it just a case of needing to insulate these pipes?

Thank you so much for any advice.

 

[ShaunCorbs]

Open the access hatches in the roof

As for the drips is it running from further up ?

 

[PleaseHelp]

Thanks. I opened the access hatch in one of the rooms. The drip is coming from the copper pipes above this plastic pipe. They are really cold so presumably that is why they are sweating.

 

[PleaseHelp]

So, to try summarise my whole issue, it seems that suddenly my copper cold water pipes are running with much colder water than usual and that, coupled with the warm weather, is causing all these drips? Do I just need to insulate them better?

Shall I try wrapping them in this?

 

[Stigster]

I haven't any experience with that particular type of insulation but yes, anything that will adequately insulate the pipework will dramatically cut down on the condensation. I just did a cylinder cupboard the other day because of this same problem. I just used standard 13mm tubular pipe lagging and it did solve the problem. These cylinders were in an enclosed cupboard so I also got the chippy to add a vent top and bottom of the cupboard doors to improve circulation which I believe also helped.

Hopefully someone knows the lagging you linked to and will be able to say if it's any good or not if that's what you want to use.

 

[PleaseHelp]

Great, thank you very much for your input. Do you think I need to worry about why the pipes are suddenly so cold?

 

[quality]

That a ducted fan coil. Do you have a chiller installed?

 

[PleaseHelp]

That a ducted fan coil. Do you have a chiller installed?

There is "comfort cooling" setting if that's what you mean, whereby the ceiling vents can be set to blow out cool air?

 

[quality]

comfort cooling on what ?

 

[PleaseHelp]

comfort cooling on what ?

The central heating system for the flat is simply those fan vents in the ceiling. They can blow hot air or there is a "cooling" setting where they blow cool air.

 

[quality]

Can you post a picture of the controller?

 

[PleaseHelp]

Can you post a picture of the controller?

Of course - please see below:

 

[quality]

Have you got a ground source heat pump?

 

[PleaseHelp]

Have you got a ground source heat pump?

I'm really sorry, I have absolutely no idea. How can I tell?

 

[quality]

Time to call in someone who knows what there doing as you have quite a non standard system installed there by looking at the pictures

 

[quality]

Where are you based?

 

[PleaseHelp]

NW London

 

[quality]

It looks to me that you have some kind of heat recover and humidity control system. Is there any equipment installed outside The property?

 

[PleaseHelp]

It's a flat in a 12 unit building. There are some Panasonic units on the walls outside on the ground floor?

 

[ShaunCorbs]

sounds like air source

 

[Brambles]

Hi,


You probably have the continuous ventilation unit on summer boost mode.

The continuous ventilation unit that you have has a large set of filters in it. These filters need to be cleaned regularly. If they become blocked or partially blocked, the pressure differential across the filters rises and the unit cuts out. If the unit fails to cut out, the exchanger will start to freeze over, to such an extent that the defrost cycle does not clear the exchanger of frost.

Consequently hot lines start to become cold and cold lines hot - in simple terms lines that don’t normally require insulation chill and condense in the atmosphere.

From your photos the hot line insulation into the Panasonic booster is well undersized. this should be at least 60mm diameter isoprene insulation Additionally the Panasonic unit should have at least 100mm of clear well ventilated space around it to function properly. Whatever is blocking the right hand side should be removed.

Not being picky, but the electrical isolation switch should be above or to the side of the unit It should not be underneath the drain point.

The quick solution is to turn off the two units and let them both return to room temperature (that may take 24 hours). The filters then need to be removed and properly cleaned or replaced.

If the unit is still operating with blocked or partially blocked filters it is likely that the pressure sensors are defective or have been removed ( people remove them to get the fan going not realising that the filter is the issue) They need to be reinstated.

I assume that you have recently moved into the property - these units are very good, but they need regular maintenance. Ask your neighbours, there will be a heating / ventilation man who regularly visits the building to undertake that routine work two or three times a year.

If you need any further clarification get back to me or indeed call Triton, they are expensive, but will come and clean / reconfigure the system for you

A final point - don’t go round insulating every pipe you can see - the condensation is almost certainty because the system is not functioning properly. You need to address the cause first, then the symptoms.

 

[PleaseHelp]

Hi,


You probably have the continuous ventilation unit on summer boost mode.

The continuous ventilation unit that you have has a large set of filters in it. These filters need to be cleaned regularly. If they become blocked or partially blocked, the pressure differential across the filters rises and the unit cuts out. If the unit fails to cut out, the exchanger will start to freeze over, to such an extent that the defrost cycle does not clear the exchanger of frost.

Consequently hot lines start to become cold and cold lines hot - in simple terms lines that don’t normally require insulation chill and condense in the atmosphere.

From your photos the hot line insulation into the Panasonic booster is well undersized. this should be at least 60mm diameter isoprene insulation Additionally the Panasonic unit should have at least 100mm of clear well ventilated space around it to function properly. Whatever is blocking the right hand side should be removed.

Not being picky, but the electrical isolation switch should be above or to the side of the unit It should not be underneath the drain point.

The quick solution is to turn off the two units and let them both return to room temperature (that may take 24 hours). The filters then need to be removed and properly cleaned or replaced.

If the unit is still operating with blocked or partially blocked filters it is likely that the pressure sensors are defective or have been removed ( people remove them to get the fan going not realising that the filter is the issue) They need to be reinstated.

I assume that you have recently moved into the property - these units are very good, but they need regular maintenance. Ask your neighbours, there will be a heating / ventilation man who regularly visits the building to undertake that routine work two or three times a year.

If you need any further clarification get back to me or indeed call Triton, they are expensive, but will come and clean / reconfigure the system for you

Thank you so much! This is super helpful. Yes, we just moved in. It's a new build and the developer has been so useless and unhelpful. It sounds like I need an engineer from Triton to come out as I would not even know where to start with the filters. I'll give them a call.

 

[Brambles]

Where about’s are you? If you are in London and you want someone to look at the installation and talk you through how to operate / maintain it get back to me. We have a Mr Expert on Titon systems - he is old, but he knows them inside out!

 

[PleaseHelp]

Where about’s are you? If you are in London and you want someone to look at the installation and talk you through how to operate / maintain it get back to me. We have a Mr Expert on Triton systems - he is old, but he knows them inside out!

Yes, I am in NW2 - that would be great - please let me have his details. Tried to contact you privately but it would not work.

 

[Brambles]

[email protected]