Pre insulated underground pipe?

[Millsy 82]

I know there is some thing of the sort but what it's called I have no idea.

Also I've only seen 2 pipes in them can you get one with 4 pipes for a combi?

 

[ShaunCorbs]

Yes what size you looking for 25-32mm ok ? Uponor quatro

https://www.uponor.co.uk/~/media/co...al/preinsulated-pipe-tech-guide.pdf?version=1

 

[missplumb]

uponor is ok for short runs but if your looking at longer runs or minimal heatloss then look at Rehau Rauthermex. its expensive but well worth the effort.
REHAU RAUTHERMEX pre-insulated heat transfer pipe,
there are others like Calpex, and Brugg which basically use each others products but Rehau make the internal piping for ALL pre-insulated piping systems

 

[jonnyswamp]

Just installed some on a barn refurb/extension
The 32mm twin is working well (I've yet to test heat loss, but not much to the touch)
However, the 25mm to the underfloor mani has a leak somewhere on the return
I didn't pressure test it as it came sealed both ends of the coil and all the coil was used (wish I did know though)
As a temp measure, I have fed some 15mm Hep through it and connected it up, I'm not hopeful it will work adequately but won't know for a week or so until the Ufloor can be turned on (waiting for tilers say so)
Looks like the machines will have to pay another visit,cos I aint digging it up

 

[kozak1968]

Just had a quote for 25 metres of Quattro (2 x 25mm and 2 x 32mm) with the end caps and fitting to convert both ends..... Just shy of £2000

 

[ShaunCorbs]

uponor is ok for short runs but if your looking at longer runs or minimal heatloss then look at Rehau Rauthermex. its expensive but well worth the effort.
REHAU RAUTHERMEX pre-insulated heat transfer pipe,
there are others like Calpex, and Brugg which basically use each others products but Rehau make the internal piping for ALL pre-insulated piping systems

they dont make a 4 in one tho

 

[Millsy 82]

Yes what size you looking for 25-32mm ok ? Uponor quatro

https://www.uponor.co.uk/~/media/co...al/preinsulated-pipe-tech-guide.pdf?version=1

It's off a combi so ideally 2-22mm minimum and 2 smaller as its a massive run for the hot and cold taps so if it is running in 25mm it will take half hour for the hot and cold to come through.

 

[Millsy 82]

How would you bring it up and into the boiler externally? As I think they have to come in at the top. Also I would have to run up the wall and in about 3 Mtrs up is this possible?

 

[village idiot]

Milsey, any particular reason why they want it to be a Combi, Considering the ''long run''?

 

[Millsy 82]

He said it is only a 2 bed and he lives by himself. I did say that it is a massive run and that because of the cottage I would have to run it up into the cottage on the 1st floor then up into the roof along and then down into the existing airing cupboard.

Over all I think it will be around 20 Mtrs before I get to the airing cupboard. If the smallest I can get is 25mm then I may say that I won't price it as its going to be unbelievable for the hot water!

 

[village idiot]

He said it is only a 2 bed and he lives by himself. I did say that it is a massive run and that because of the cottage I would have to run it up into the cottage on the 1st floor then up into the roof along and then down into the existing airing cupboard.

Over all I think it will be around 20 Mtrs before I get to the airing cupboard. If the smallest I can get is 25mm then I may say that I won't price it as its going to be unbelievable for the hot water!

To be honest, I'd make my excuses and encourage him to get someone else to do the job. Should you go ahead, there's every chance he will be on the phone most of the time complaining he has to wait a long time to get hot water at shower. Some jobs, it pays to walk away.

 

[Millsy 82]

I told him that I recommend moving the oil tank and boiler to the rear of the house. Otherwise fit an lpg combi in the airing cupboard.

 

[gassafe]

I

He said it is only a 2 bed and he lives by himself. I did say that it is a massive run and that because of the cottage I would have to run it up into the cottage on the 1st floor then up into the roof along and then down into the existing airing cupboard.

Over all I think it will be around 20 Mtrs before I get to the airing cupboard. If the smallest I can get is 25mm then I may say that I won't price it as its going to be unbelievable for the hot water!

20 meter dead leg would be unreal!!!!! Plus the temperature drop over the pipework.... I doubt he will be happy, & happy customers don't pay!

 

[Millsy 82]

I reckon he will half fill his bath before he gets any hot water. I don't think he realises though.

What depth should it be buried? As to get it in I would have to run through a gap of about a foot in between the conservatory and a stone wall so doubt I would get it very deep.

I have decided I won't price for it but I don't want to just say F off and would rather tell him why.

 

[ShaunCorbs]

I reckon he will half fill his bath before he gets any hot water. I don't think he realises though.

What depth should it be buried? As to get it in I would have to run through a gap of about a foot in between the conservatory and a stone wall so doubt I would get it very deep.

I have decided I won't price for it but I don't want to just say F off and would rather tell him why.

normally round 500-750mm depends if loaded (cars etc)

 

[Millsy 82]

No cars just across a footpath.

 

[ShaunCorbs]

No cars just across a footpath.

deeper the better but 500mm is min i think

 

[jonnyswamp]

Uponor was 750mm IIRC

 

[Millsy 82]

I don't think I would get it deep enough without breaking out the footings of the conservatory.

 

[ShaunCorbs]

Uponor was 750mm IIRC

https://www.uponor.co.uk/~/media/co...al/preinsulated-pipe-tech-guide.pdf?version=1

pg 27

400mm

 

[Nostrum]

Just tell him how much the pipe and transition kit is, it'll put him off easily.

We used flex energy last time as customer decided to put heat pump across the garden path, 6 Mtrs of duo 32mm and transition kits was about £400 / £30 p/metre.

The bend radius on flex energy pipe is 600mm so we dug the trench and managed to terminate vertically. Some of the pipe is very very stiff. In that case you'd need the entry kits each end which will add another £150-£200 to each end.

As someone else suggested, your 20 metre run plus fittings will cost £1000 +

Where's it going to be that far away? Garage?

 

[Millsy 82]

He was not overly worried about the price the other bloke gave him. Or at least he didn't seem to be.

The reason that it will be that much of a run is because.

It will be external oil boiler and the only place I can get it away from Windows etc it would have to go about 1.5 Mtrs from conservatory, because of how the cottage is built the easiest way to get in will be to run 8 Mtrs underground then 4 Mtrs up wall and into the bedroom, then reduce hot and cold down to 15mm then run up into the roof space then along about 8 Mtrs then down into the airing cupboard in the bathroom.

If I could put it at the back of the house then I could pop the pipes through the wall into a downstairs toilet.

 

[missplumb]

underground pipe is not very flexible at all, and as Nostrum says, you have special fittings to convert to copper etc and usually a specialised crimper is used. On the Rehau you can use preformed elbows to get you nice and neatly up the wall but again they are expensive and bulky once you fit the shrouds and insulation. You wouldnt be able to bend any of the makes out of the ground, up a wall and then into a loft without knocking a hole out about 2 foot square!!! tell him it will look stupid and he'll have such a bad dead leg that you wouldnt want to waste his money doing an installation that will not give him the best efficiency for his money. If he still wants it doing, get it in writing that you have told him the pitfalls and give him a huge quote.