Rate my [council appointed contractor's) lagging!

[Tardigrade]

Album — Postimage.org

Hopefully the image link works - first time doing that.


My builder told me good lagging looks like this:

The council - leaseholder - has appointed contractors to remediate the prior remediation work done by other council contractors, for a heating job done by other council contractors.

The council refused to let me appoint my own guys.

The result is the photos - and they distinctly do not look like youtube videos. The photos actually make it look better - if you put your hand around the back of the joints you can feel substantial finger sized gaps, for example.

My question is: is this work, "not ideal", but also "not that bad" / "industry standard"? Or, is it as bad as it feels to me it is? I'll need ammunition to complain and get it redone...AGAIN....

Thanks!

 

[ShaunCorbs]

It's not bad for council standards but there low already

It's something where you have to allow time for

I would recommend doing it again at your own cost as you can try and get the council back but they wont

 

[Tardigrade]

I kind of need serious replies...and not sure how to interpret yours

Ultimately I paid for this work - so I have a right to demand a good standards. I just need help in determinin if this is objectively not a good standard for work of this type.

 

[Pickwickpick]

Have seen much worse lagging than that out there, based on those photos alone (might look worse in real life) I can't see the council getting it redone.

 

[Tardigrade]

Sorry, but the respose is again ambiguous. There exists bad work "out there", so having "seen worse" isn't a standard.

Let me rephrase. At "plumber school" would they say: it's ok to leave gaps where there are clips rather than cover them as in the video? Is it ok to leave all the more complex pipework with valves etc exposed? Is it ok for the odd finger sized gap in lagging, because it hasn't been cut well, and because no solvent was used in the video?

Would private householders look at this and agree a builder has fuflilled their contract? Or would they say, "this isn't good enough, re-do it"?

 

[rpm]

Come again?

 

[Tardigrade]

I'm not sure which part of that quote is unclear?

 

[Pickwickpick]

Sorry, but the respose is again ambiguous. There exists bad work "out there", so having "seen worse" isn't a standard.

Let me rephrase. At "plumber school" would they say: it's ok to leave gaps where there are clips rather than cover them as in the video? Is it ok to leave all the more complex pipework with valves etc exposed? Is it ok for the odd finger sized gap in lagging, because it hasn't been cut well, and because no solvent was used in the video?

Would private householders look at this and agree a builder has fuflilled their contract? Or would they say, "this isn't good enough, re-do it"?

Sorry for the ambiguous response, but its not a clear cut scenario imo. Yes it could definitely be neater and more effective, I personally would never walk away from a job that looks like that. But I see lagging on a regular basis that looks considerably worse than that, my personal opinion is that I can't see the council agreeing to get it rectified based on those photos. Now if you've paid for it yourself you're well within your rights to demand it a textbook finish and for it to be rectified, but seeing as you going through the council I think you;re going to struggle.

 

[Tardigrade]

I have paid for it myself, through a S20 council major works notice. I have exactly the same rights I would have had I paid someone directly. It's just far more of a hassle (appeals, tribunals etc) to get there.

Thanks for your response. I think I need to re-post this elsewhere and clarify that I'm not looking for people to tell me how tough it is to get the council to do a job properly...

The key bit, is you say you wouldn't leave a job like this. I need more of those...

 

[rpm]

I`m thinking how does somebody living in a council owned property have a "My builder"?
Edit just seen reply from the OP.

 

[Pickwickpick]

I have paid for it myself, through a S20 council major works notice. I have exactly the same rights I would have had I paid someone directly. It's just far more of a hassle (appeals, tribunals etc) to get there.

Thanks for your response. I think I need to re-post this elsewhere and clarify that I'm not looking for people to tell me how tough it is to get the council to do a job properly...

The key bit, is you say you wouldn't leave a job like this. I need more of those...

Yes but your initial question was:

is this work, "not ideal", but also "not that bad" / "industry standard"? Or, is it as bad as it feels to me it is?

It is definitely in the "not ideal but not that bad" category, hence my point that you will struggle to get anywhere. Now if you had organised this work directly yourself you could have agreed with tradesman up front that you wanted it lagged in such a manner (I don;t think I've ever come across lagging that's been solvent welded together) and would probably have had to pay extra for the increase time spent. Lagging is something that is consistently not given the level of care it deserves, but that's not just a tradesman things, its predominantly a client thing. A significant proportion of clients when given the choice will go for the smaller bill and less time spent on lagging.

 

[Welder]

I assume this is heating pipework. If not then it is useless. Why? Because any gaps will let too much heat out and it will not stop it freezing.
If it's for heat loss minimisation on a heating system its bad. Take a look at the Armaflex website and download their own installation manual. At that point you will see the difference and be able to 'point' to the very significant differences in quality and acceptability.
HTH

 

[SimonG]

It's not a forum for bashing contractors. Sometimes blatantly bad is self explanatory.
Always two sides to a story.

If not happy then tell original contractor you will pay a third party to inspect and report. If the original work is sub standard then you will look for reimbursement and the works doing properly.

 

[Tardigrade]

Thank you - that is a huge disparity in opinion from "its not great, but not uncommon" to "it is useless".

If it helps:
1x cold water pipe
2x heat-exchanger pipes, they call "district"(?) pipes
2x hot water/heating pipes.

 

[SimonG]

If it's the 3 pictutes in the album title then it is what it is. Seen a lot worse, that's for sure.

Also depends what it cost you.

 

[Tardigrade]

[double post]

 

[Tardigrade]

the work wasn't specifically costed in a line item. The whole project cost 15k per flat (290 odd flats), but that was for the heat exchanger, new piper work, replacement central block boilers, etc.

 

[Welder]

I suggest you get an independent survey done. That will either put your mind at rest or give you the ammo you seem to need. No one on here can give you a definitive answer as we cannot see the job.
Sorry but that's the truth.

 

[Tardigrade]

Thanks - what differentiates a 3rd party plumber providing an opinion, from a "survey"? Who would carry that out? ie the chap that is doing other work for me has confirmed it is indeed poor...but does it have to be an engineer? Formal report?

 

[Welder]

TBH if you lack the intelligence to answer your own question then that tells us all we need to know.
FWIW, the answer is contained within your question
Edit: I'm out.

 

[SimonG]

When was the work done?

 

[SimonG]

I

 

[SimonG]

This ones still open.....




For now

 

[Harvest Fields]

Ohhh now I understand.