Should I Upgrade my CH Boiler?

[MacGromit]

My CH boiler is an Ideal Standard E Type CF Model 60N installed in the mid '70s and has worked well over the period with just some periodic cleaning and checking. With various extensions to the house over the years it is now struggling to cope on the colder days of winter and needs to run at the highest temperature setting and with some back up from the HW cylinder immerser (now on a time clock because the 1960s thermostat no longer works).

The cylinder has retro fit insulation and one of the original Yorkshire Sidewinder conversion coils in, and with the immerser stat. not working I know I should probably be upgrading it.

About the boiler however, can anyone tell me if I should be upgrading that to something like an Ideal Mexico 24Kw for more output, and what efficiency savings I might gain, if any?

Many thanks

 

[gassafe]

Definitely in need of an overhaul... I doubt your still driving a car from the 70's so why keep that old boiler going!!! Must be 60% efficient compared to a 90% modern condensing boiler!

Probs need a good flush through the system, fit thermostat valves on the radiators, install a room stat & upgrade controls... Welcome to the 21st century

 

[jase158]

But if it ain't broke.....

 

[jtsplumbing]

From what you are describing with all the extras added on to the system your boiler is undersized, but from what you are explaining it will need more than just the boiler replacing in order to upgrade your system, Get someone in to give you information & a quote, (at least 3)

 

[gassafe]

But if it ain't broke.....

Ha, his old boiler will never break they keep on going forever...

 

[PhoenixServices]

As above get some quotes to upgrade it and the parts of the system that need it. Or post your location on here and someone local could have a look. [DLMURL="http://www.ukplumbersforums.co.uk/im-looking-plumber-gas-engineer/"]I'm looking for a Plumber or Gas Engineer[/DLMURL]

 

[IDCHAPPY]

Embrace the 2000's and be nice to your house , fit a modern boiler

 

[MacGromit]

Thanks for all comments. The guy who services the boiler agrees that it would run forever, and last year he flushed the system for me. Also I have had thermostatic rad valves on the radiators for 25 years and they still work okay (if only I could get the good lady to close doors :disappointed. Nor am I looking for a pressurised system that would involve breaking open oak and tiled floors.

Something nice and simple to boost output and perhaps save a little money would be nice if it didn't cost too much. A cylinder change and straight boiler swop would seem to be a nicely measured compromise.

If you think a 30% gas usage reduction is reasonable I'll work around that for estimating possible savings. I just wondered what the equivalent to an existing 60,000 Btu (17.5Kwh) x 60% would represent in modern 90% efficient boiler terms (and then add a bit - say to 24Kwh). I have tried to find the answer on some comparison web sites but you have to quote the boiler model and mine is too old to be included on them.

 

[dmheat]

A simple boiler "swap" and cylinder swap is infact unlikely to be that simple I'm sorry to say.

Different flue may mean re-siting your boiler, it's likely your current gas supply to the boiler will be undersized, you'll need to accommodate a condensate waste from the new boiler,and if your controls don't meet current building regs then unfortunately whether you want to or not certain parts of your system may need upgrading.

As mentioned,get at least 3 quotes,but that job doesn't sound remotely like a swap,just preparing you not to expect cheap that's all!

Good luck!

 

[MacGromit]

Okay, thanks for that. It's wise counsel and it's noted. We've had the house for 45 years - if it turns out that it's going to be a major upheaval I think we'll just do the cylinder and let the next people do the rest! :wink_smile:

Cheers.

 

[kris]

I would defo overhaul both as the boiler you have will be a gas guzzler, like previously said its only 60-70% efficient and you don't get the good of some of the units being burned, you could always get an estimate and shop around n try get someone to do cylinder and boiler,

 

[Ray Stafford]

The cylinder has retro fit insulation and one of the original Yorkshire Sidewinder conversion coils in, and with the immerser stat. not working I know I should probably be upgrading it.
Many thanks

I would change the cylinder first. Retrofit insulation - do you mean a fibre jacket? Better than nothing, but ineffective compared to 50mm of foam. Sidewinder coils were inefficient even by the standards of the day, and after 30 or 40 years it must be hideously inefficient. And it shouldn't need back up from the immersion heater in normal usage unless you have a spike in demand for hot water.

I reckon if you overhaul the domestic hot water set up first, the fuel saving per £ invested will be 3 or 4 times higher than doing the whole thing. Decide about the boiler later.

 

[MacGromit]

Thanks Ray. Actually the diy insulation is aluminium foil bubble wrap taken around and over the cylinder and taped in place, which is claimed to be equivalent to 50mm wool. But you make a very sound suggestion about doing the cylinder first in terms of cost/benefit. That'll be my plan I think.

I've always been suspicious about the cylinder coil ever since the boiler began to struggle to properly heat the domestic water, even in Summer. It's a strange thing but the radiators are very much hotter when I've had the immerser on for a few hours, and I suspect that the cylinder may actually be acting as a sort of 'thermal store cylinder' - i.e. the Sidewinder is actually removing immerser generated heat back to the boiler for the benefit of the radiators (reverse boost !!??).