Shower Sealant failure

[andy fry]

Hi,

I've fitted a shower tray and enclosure at a customers house. Followed what i believe to be all the key rules, the tray is firm and level, tiled down onto the tray, sealed all the way around the tray before putting the enclosure profiles on. But I've felt the underside of the silicone is wet as it comes down the front edge of the tray, outside the enclosure. I could understand this if water was getting down behind the enclosure profile but as mentioned the whole tray got sealed before hand.

I would love some advice from people who may have come across this before or could the water be getting through else where? I have sealed around the whole of the out side of the enclosure. I'm a little reluctant to take the enclosure off as its in between two tiles walls and was a bugger to get in. (Possibily disturbing the silicone when installed??)

 

[Hardy1]

put the shower tray in place, any gaps pack them in, then silcione around the tray(let it dry), thenn tilee, then seal again-Never fails...but im confused how you've done it and it hasnt work first time ive heard of it-maybe its just one of them jobs, did you pack the sides in if there were any gaps before siliconing?

 

[andy fry]

Thanks for replying,

no packing was needed, i let the silocone dry over night before fitting the enclosure, I've only been self employed for 18 months. Before hand i was working for a local bathroom company but never did much sealing of shower and baths, that was left to others. I didn't think i was doing too much wrong so its a little un-nerving to find things like this.

 

[Hardy1]

yeah i understand, should silicone and then let dry then tile and then silicone again, if thats what you've done then im confused just as much as you are.

 

[andy fry]

Thanks pal,

I guess the only way to know is to take the enclosure off and see what state the silicone is as it runs under the profiles.

All good fun.

Thanks again

 

[Phil]

How long did you leave the grout before siliconing?

Grout shrinks when it dries and pulls away from the silicone, you could be getting water through where the vertical grout joints meet the bottom of the tray.

Have a look for the tinyest gap, thats all it needs, water will be pulled straight in there.

 

[PlumbBobBob]

did you silicone the corners of the walls where the tiles meet or grout?

 

[andy fry]

Hi guys, i normally leave the grout overnight, then dust them off. The corners all got siliconed and so did the tray as previously mentioned. hmm bit of a puzzle.

Thanks for your thoughts. Phil and Steve b could i ask if you were installing a shower tray and enclosure what your general procedure would be for sealing them? As i mentioned i dont think im doing too much wrong?


Thanks again for your time

Much appreciated

Andy

 

[desrob]

i like it, sealant failure,no no never the installer....!!

 

[Phil]

I first squash the tray onto the wall with plenty of silicone (about a tube for 1200x800), tile onto it and seal again.

Fit enclosure and seal the outside only, although I do sometimes put a little inside in certain areas.

Leave 24 hrs and test with shower head all over the inside of the tray and check for leaks, some take hours to show, thats the trouble.

 

[andy fry]

yeah cheers phil,

the job was done back in feb! no signs of any water marks on the ceiling below or anything. i just noticed when i was back there today the silicone as it comes from the enclosure profile along and down the front of the tray to the floor on one side, the silicone was a little squiggy and wet when you push your finger into it.

As you say though, surely if it would leak, it would leak from day one?

 

[Phil]

What make of silicone do you use andy?

 

[dontknowitall]

As I understand it, if it's leaking from the enclosure/shower tray join then usually the instructions tell you to seal the outside of the enclosure. I'm not saying you haven't done this but it not, then sealing around the outside might cure it.

Also, silicone can shrink and/or crack. Not that unusual and it's my guess that it's down to the quality of the siliconem not how it was applied, especially if it takes a few months for someone to phone up about a leak.

 

[Best]

The silicone doesn't grab the enclosure, where there are large gaps. If tight gap, then should seal no problem. Better on large gap to seal twice. I notice a lot of shower enclosures leaking where the vertical frame meets the horizontal. Sometimes hard to spot water going down to top of tray.

 

[PlumbBobBob]

i would go over the silicone with a bright torch and look closely at every bit for the smallest bit that hasn't stuck properly. could be very small but big enough to let water seep through.

 

[andy fry]

thanks guys,

I use good quality silicone. On this particular job it was unibond sanitary sealant (cream) let that dry etc, fitted the enclosure and went over the top with dow corning 785 (clear).

 

[andy fry]

oh and yes the out side of the enclosure was sealed with the dow corning clear

 

[dontknowitall]

Well - if you used good quality silicone and it cracks/leaks after a few months and I use cheap stuff and it doesn't perhaps we're all better off with cheap stuff and trusting that we'll be called out occasionally but will save £££'s over the years?