Toilet Cistern Noise

[Phillay]

Hi,

I'm wondering if someone with some good fault finding experience could offer me a little advise please? I qualified about half a year ago, so as you can imagine, experience is a little lacking at the moment. Also new to the forums!

A customer I visited recently has an older close-coupled toilet. Typical syphon and ball valve set up and the overflow exits through the wall to the outside. The ball valve has recently been adjusted slightly as the water level was filing too high.

This has corrected the water level (now finishes at the water line marked on the inside of the cistern) and the ball valve correctly shuts off after filing. However, when you flush the toilet, you get a very loud trumpet sound & small vibration for around 2-3 secs. This then stops and the toilet fills up fine with no further noise of any kind.

The toilet operates off mains pressure (no water tank) and from what I can see, it's good pressure.

Any ideas why this would occur? I thought it could be down to wearing parts in the ball valve, but would have thought if that was the case, it wouldn't shut off after filing and would continue to trickle.

Just to add, if you flush the toilet before it has chance to completely finish filing, you get no sound. This seems to occur only when the toilet cistern has finished filling.

Thank you in advance!

 

[JCplumb]

You hit the nail on the head. The valve is not what it once was. I'd usually replace the whole valve to be sure it's fixed, but many people will change components of the valve to resolve this issue. New valves are cheap enough to not warrant trying to fix an old one imo.

 

[nicro3]

Welcome- Have you tried putting in a high pressure orifice?

 

[Phillay]

Thanks for that JCplumb, good to know my instincts were somewhere in the ball park!

Nicro3, cheers, I've not made any attempt to repair yet as wanted to get it right in my head first, but I believe the high pressure orifice is already fitted as the low pressure one's sat clipped to the side of the ball valve.

Reckon I'll suggest a replacement and see where I go from there. Thanks again for the responses.

 

[SimonG]

Drop a new washer in the inlet valve, that should cure it.

 

[Koogatubac]

Problems lying around the seating washer. However just as other experienced professional plumbers have mentioned already, just replace the cistern inlet valve, quicker and easier to do instead of the tradionally way of stripping the part and replacing new

 

[Phil]

Personally I fix rather than throw out, plus it means I don't have to order another ballvalve, hate this throwaway culture we live in.

 

[DustyM]

Personally I fix rather than throw out, plus it means I don't have to order another ballvalve, hate this throwaway culture we live in.

Well said Phil; I too prefer to repair rather than replace - sometimes it's just too easy to charge the customer for a new part entirely..........................

 

[Best]

The diaphragm washers on the usual ball valves tend to bulge out permanately as it ages, or get a bit rough where the washer seals on the "nozzle" seating part. When the valve is nearly closed the water is passing it at a speck of an opening & so makes weird noises. Just a new washer should sort it, BUT, although I also think things that are fixable should be fixed & not thrown out, I would recommend a Fluidmaster brass tail pro valve on a mains fed toilet, as it is really more suitable for high pressure, very quiet & comes with a flow reducer.

 

[JCplumb]

Well said Phil; I too prefer to repair rather than replace - sometimes it's just too easy to charge the customer for a new part entirely..........................

I used to ask the customer if they wanted me to fix rather than replace, with a ball operated valve the difference in price is literally a few quid, 9 times out of 10 the customer would want a new valve.
If you fix then there is the likelihood that other parts are worn and the valve may not last as long as a new one.
If it's a £15 valve then replacing a diaphragm would be the preferred route, but for a cheap part 2 valve I'd say the long term benefit outweighs the few quid difference in price.
I've had a customer who wanted me to fix a FOV before but where the brass arm connected to the valve body with a cotterpin it was too narrow for the replacement arm I had with me so i spent half an hour filing it down to fit it. That cost a lot more than a replacement would have done.