Vaillant low quality product

[Maxy44]

In December 2008 we purchased and have had installed a ecoTEC plus Vaillant boiler. I don't know the exact model but we purchased one that would have been sufficient for a five bedroom house. Our house is three bedrooms.
It was fitted by 3 Corgi engineers and we added a filter to the pipes too.

In November 2013 (almost five years old) boiler breaks down. It was serviced in 2010 and 2012.

Fault was with the pump. The engineer stripped the whole boiler too and cleaned every single component. However, one week later the boiler broke down again and, from this time onwards, we called Vaillant ....a few times

3[SUP]rd[/SUP] December 2013 – Replaced PCB (labour charge only, no charge for part).
30[SUP]th[/SUP] December 2013 – Further parts required, ordered from site.
4[SUP]th[/SUP] January 2014 – Replaced fan, flexible hose and gasket kit.
7[SUP]th[/SUP] January 2014 – Replaced central heating NTC sensor, took central heating system turbidity reading at 700ppm - Recommended system cleanse.

The system was cleaned two weeks later but the water was not as dirty as expected.

Vaillant examined the old pump and placed the blame on London water. Due to magnetic 'gunk'.

What about the rest of the "equipment" that has gone faulty? I have had the old motherboard checked by an engineer and he couldn't find anything wrong with it.

The Forum moderator posted this comment about life on boilers: A) potterton performa/105e 15-20 years; duotec will be about the same maybe as most vailents.

Does any expert have some explanation please on why we have had to spend almost £1,200 to have a 5 years old boiler serviced and repaired, please?
THANK YOU

 

[AWheating]

Nobody on this site will be able to give you an answer about your boiler. We can tell you about our experiences with products we have installed and maintained and gossip about the stuff we have never used or fitted.

From my experience vaillant make decent appliances, but I don't service and repair many so I've never seen May issues with there stuff.

its sounds like you have been unlucky. Modern boilers have a life span of 5 to 15 years dependant on the way it's been installed, the system it connected to and it's use.

 

[Killy Bing]

Why does it sound like a fishing trip to get a statement to quote to vailliant.

It's good kit, rare to have problems, any that they have had they've put their hands up.

Most issues have cropped up due to poor installation from my limited experience.

did you have any electrical works done to the house upto 6 months before the issues started?

 

[Ray Stafford]

I can't answer your question, but I do have some observations.

In December 2008 we purchased..

In November 2013 (almost five years old) boiler breaks down. It was serviced in 2010 and 2012.

The manufacturers instructions mandate annual servicing. You ignored that, and had it serviced half as often as it should have been. If you had your car serviced only twice in 5 years, would you not think that you were inviting problems?

My second point is that people think of a boiler as if it was a stand-alone appliance, like a washing machine or fridge. It isn't. It is a component in a larger system, (both mechanical and electrical) and the cleanliness and design of that system has a big impact on product reliability and lifespan.

Finally, your post reads like a tactical move in an ongoing dispute with Vaillant - using social media to try to pressurise them into doing something. Thats fair enough, but I suggest you stick to Facebook and Twitter, and avoid forums where a large number of well informed experts are unlikely to be swayed. Vaillant have a reputation for outstanding product quality that most of their competitors would die for. I have to say that their technical excellence is not always backed up by good communications skills, but thats another matter.

 

[SimonG]

Tbh you cannot slag down the manufacturer when by your own admission you have not looked after the equipment to the manufacturers requirenent.

Was a chemical clean performed when the boiler was installed?

At 5 years old and not serviced annualy then i think you have done well to get vaillant to fix your boiler and only charge labour. Theres many a manufacturer who would have asked to see the service record and say tough, charge you for wasting their time and walk away. WB springs to mind.

 

[Nostrum]

I have an Ecotec in my own home and it has been faultless up to now. On the other hand i've been repairing them for the last 3 years and can say that they are very sensitive pieces of kit.

My own opinion is that they are not ideally suitable for a large proportion of UK systems that tend to be below par in quality when compared to the European standards. This is mainly to do with cost and the undervalued trade we work in where people expect to pay as little as possible for one of the most important pieces of kit in your house. Now i'm not saying this is the case in your example, but competition leads to price reduction and their is only so far you can go before corners get cut etc

They are great boilers but need a great system to work on. I've just taken one out at 7 years old, beyond economical repair so replaced. Personally, my opinion is that if the job was done right on installation, which would have cost maybe another £300-£400 then the boiler would have still been going strong in 5 years time, so its a false economy really.

From reading your post most of the parts you have replaced do not seem to be linked by any common factor, so I would say you have either been unlucky or the engineers you've had working on it have misdiagnosed parts (particularly if the PCB is tested to be good.)

 

[hammers4spanner]

people are always quick to blame installations although alot of installs are nails its not always the case,
Everytime i price to do a boiler change the cust would ask are they good reliable boilers to which i will clearly state yes they are however sometimes lemons do leave the factory .
Compare a boiler with a car and its same same mercs are decent bits of kit however they will have the odd lemon .
Anything thats manufactured and has working parts will have faults it goes hand in hand .

IMO in this instance you may have a lemon it happens which is why it pays to have long warranty

 

[buckley plumb]

intergas have the right idea - a boiler to suit the dirty systems

 

[AWheating]

intergas have the right idea - a boiler to suit the dirty systems

But it's like a doctor treating the symptoms rather than the illness.

 

[Maxy44]

Thank you all (so many) for your replies.
A few points, please, I wish to add.
a) Installation was carried to the highest possible standards. This is not our first house or first boiler. Boiler water treatment chemicals were added plus a small cylinder (water purifier?) added to the piping system. Three Corgi engineers, around 6 hours and £900 to install it.
b) Correctly so, customer service from Vaillant is not very good
c) From 1976 to 2004 we have never had such problems with any boiler. Four houses + two flats
d) When in 2008 the old boiler (I mean old as it was in the house when we bought it in 2004) broke down, instead of a £300 repair I felt it was a good idea to have a new, more powerful one instead (now I have the wife nagging and telling me how wrong I was). Do you know how that feels like!?
e) Do you really service your car every year? I don't. It depends on mileage. Last gap has been a two years period as, since 2012, I must have done no more than 4000 miles in my car.
f) I have no personal dispute with Vaillant at the moment. I have made enough comments on Facebook at that time.
g) On count of probabilities, if the boiler was serviced every year and the above was still going wrong, who should we blame this time? (...the wrong type of snow)??? We should only allow British Rail for such "jokes".
h) As it happens boilers are meant to be working with water (no rocket science). I am no boiler engineer but for so many components to go wrong one after the other only indicates to me that there is (was) something drastically wrong with the components or manufacturing to start with.

I am passionate about watches and it has been my hobby for over 50 years. However I will be the first one to state that watches do not need to be serviced every year and that a £5,000 Rolex is no better than a £300 Tissot or Longines. I do not expect anyone to "spit on their plate" and tell me what they really believe is going on with my boiler. My personal experience with Vaillant (and two BMW 5 series) is negative based on personal experience/circumstances. This is why we now drive Audi and Skoda and this is why we will never buy a Vaillant again. Luck should not come into the equation and if this is just the odd one out, Vaillant should have also been more pro-active in providing 'some' and better customer service.

[h=1][/h]

 

[Ermintrude]

£900 to install it and 3 corgi guys? Been gas safe for a while? I couldn't do that. Each "corgi" guy is on more than £300 aday when you look at running costs. We never pilut more than two engineers on a job it's not effective. 3 apprentices yes. All done in one day was it? System to combi. Bish bash botch. You probably got micro-bore and bypass in boiler never used. Probably never flushed probably no stat.

 

[Maxy44]

I never said system to combi. It was combi before too. All new radiators and most pipes were installed in 2004 when we purchased the house; we just didn't change the boiler then.

 

[Whyme]

i only really get 3 things wrong with that age vaillant, pump, diverter valve and those rubber hoses. i think youve been unlucky. every single manufacturer will make boilers with an Achilles heel or heels that will only become evident out in the big wide world and they all keep reworking and in some cases redesigning the components to fix it. again i think you got a Friday afternoon boiler. as far as your 1976 to whenever point goes those boilers had a hell of a lot less to go wrong just a gas valve stat and burner its like comparing a pushbike to a car.

 

[Ollieg]

I have a 7 year old Vaillant Eco tec plus 837 . It has never let me down. Ever.
I have the wilo pump the rubber pipes and the leaky leaky diverter valve that never leaked.
Another thing I have is a clean heating system.
It took a 9 hour powerflush to get my 30 year old system clean enough to fit a modern boiler. I only have 7 Rads.
I wonder how long your system was cleaned for?
Its all about the prep.


I also have a 285000 mile BMW 528 that needed a new battery 2 years ago. Only let me down that once.

 

[LPC]

You've been unlucky. Bad luck. They're good boilers, one of the best, and if installed correctly you have a higher-than-average chance of getting many years service out of it. You can buy the finest brand money can buy of anything and still get problems. Nothing as complex as a boiler and which relies on so many outside factors can ever be foolproof.

Not sure what the point of your post is? We're heating engineers. We know a lot more about boilers than you do. What are you trying to achieve?

If you're that worried, get a new boiler and move on.

 

[A1P]

It sounds like you may have had Friday afternoon boiler combined with insufficient cleaning of the system.It may well have required a full powerflush.Your installer should also have made clear that for the guarantee to be valid,annual services are obligatory.Was a filter fiitted?Once again to maintain a properly cleaned system this is essential.

 

[Ray Stafford]

c) From 1976 to 2004 we have never had such problems with any boiler. Four houses + two flats

Indeed. I had a similar experience. And the appliances that we "never had any problems with" were about 70% efficient the day they were made, and about 45% efficient after 20 years. But energy was cheap and we didn't know any better.

Modern appliances are 90% efficient, but to get those efficiencies means losing some of the robust simplicity of yesteryear.

e) Do you really service your car every year? I don't. It depends on mileage. Last gap has been a two years period as, since 2012, I must have done no more than 4000 miles in my car.

.

Yes, I do at the moment, because I have a car with an unlimited mileage 5 year warranty. However, that warranty depends on me sticking to the manufacturers recommended service schedule, and if I didn't I would not expect them to honour my warranty.

I am no boiler engineer but for so many components to go wrong one after the other only indicates to me that there is (was) something drastically wrong with the components or manufacturing to start with.

You should have stopped after the highlighted part.

 

[Killy Bing]

I'm just going to say we are all collectively shaking our heads.


As for the three guys who did the system to the highest possible standard
fitting a days work powerflushing
a days work installing the boiler and converting the system
likely half a day doing other bits and bobs also to the highest possible standard.

all into 6 hours for £900
can you pass me their details?

they can work for me.

 

[Whyme]

I reckon ray should do a sticky on how to assemble a proper post.

 

[TBServices]

I think you've been unlucky, in both your choice of installer, and your particular boiler.

Vaillants on the whole are good quality, reliable boilers, although as said, highly sensitive to system conditions due to over engineering.

Your MIs state your boiler must be serviced and logged as such ANNUALLY. If you don't follow their instruction, they're well within their rights to deny a free repair. However, I suspect at the time your boiler only came with a 2/3 year warranty.

EDIT. I agree with you on the BMW 5 series. I had a 530i m sport and it was the most temperamental and unreliable car I've ever owned. Again, over engineered.

I now drive an Octavia VRS.

 

[LPC]

I drive a 21 year old Peugeot 205 GTi and a 14 year old Citroen Dispatch. You don't know the meaning of unreliable!

 

[IDCHAPPY]

Always get your car or van serviced every 6 months... hang on wrong forum

 

[Whyme]

Ive got a 2008 ford focus and the wing mirrors fly off every time my wife uses it. ford should have a recall.

 

[lame plumber]

if your not servicing your audi and skada each year and relying on 20000 mile service intervals you have an expensive surprise coming soon.

 

[lame plumber]

if your not servicing your audi and skoda each year and relying on 20000 mile service intervals you have an expensive surprise coming soon.