Valiant 837..... my gas metre is racing

[Foxyuk]

hi guys i got a valiant 837 fitted last week all new pipework and radiators , At the moment the house has no carpets etc and i have it on in the morning ang night for an hour via a siemens wiresless remote.

i went in tonight and turned it on for 5 mins and watched the metre (last 3 digits) spin like a sprinter..... it actualy went up 1/2 a unit with that time

i have the new type metre and its dated 2009.... the house temperature was 12.5 and i turned it to 17.5 its a metric unit 1 metric unit is 11.05 kwh so in 5 mins used about 6kwh


where do i start because somethings not right????

can it be a fauly gas meter?
faulty boiler?

At present im staying at relations until the house is refurbed and my relations use 2 units a day gas and house is roasting ........

help!!!

 

[Simon F]

as the house is cold the boiler will be working at full rate. fire the boiler up, take a reading, time for 120 seconds take a second reading. deduct the first from the second to give an accurate result post the reading and someone will be able to tell you if this is a problem or not

 

[Foxyuk]

ok thanks not at house till tomorrow am.... so u saying time 2 mins take reading then another 2 mins without touching then see if anything different? based on my calcs its 90kwh which totally not on ....

 

[Simon F]

on a metric meter the gas rate is calculated based on the amount of gas used in a two minute period, this is with the appliance working at maximum.
you say it was only fitted last week, did the fitter not gas rate the appliance? if you have concerns give him a call

 

[CES]

What are your meter readings?

 

[Foxyuk]

What are your meter readings?

ok here we go--- fitted 30/12 reading 8240
7/1 reading 8328 thats set 6.30am to 8.30am, 4.30 to 10pm

equates to 88 units in 8 days based on when took reading..... 11 units a day

8/1- 8331.375 and that was it on only 630am to 830am

since 8th its been on the setting to come on if falls below 5 degrees...... when i went uo today it was sitting at 8343.100 mind you wife was in for 20 mins last night and turned heating on and tep not fallen below 5 degrees

toinght i turned on at 6.03pm it was 8343.100 and by 6.08pm it was 8343.780

its now set back to kicking in if below 5 degrees

 

[REDSAW]

in the back of the instruction manual, there is a commisioning report.
what has the installer recorded for the gas in the entry?.

 

[Foxyuk]

in the back of the instruction manual, there is a commisioning report.
what has the installer recorded for the gas in the entry?.

hi there its not filled in yet he is due out tomorrow to fit gas hob.... what do i need to be asking him too do?

 

[CES]

I think there something dodgy going on. According to your last two readings there was a difference of 0.680m3 in 5 minutes, calculating this for 2 mins would be .272m3
HI would be 0.272 x 321 = 87kW, GR would be approx 8m3/hr therefore its double what you would expect from this boiler.
I would be on the phone to the installer. Check to see if the Benchmark (commissioning report) is filled in at the back of the manual (as Redsaw has said), if its not then get the installer back as he hasnt commissioned the appliance to the manufacturers instructions and your warranty would be void as the benchmark is required to validate it.

 

[Foxyuk]

I think there something dodgy going on. According to your last two readings there was a difference of 0.680m3 in 5 minutes, calculating this for 2 mins would be .272m3
HI would be 0.272 x 321 = 87kW, GR would be approx 8m3/hr therefore its double what you would expect from this boiler.
I would be on the phone to the installer. Check to see if the Benchmark (commissioning report) is filled in at the back of the manual (as Redsaw has said), if its not then get the installer back as he hasnt commissioned the appliance to the manufacturers instructions and your warranty would be void as the benchmark is required to validate it.

just spoke to heating engineers he said there is no leak and boiler has been commisioned and checked out and hes still to fill in the paperwork.he said the boiler is a 37kwh so its impossible to burn more than that.......

i have contacted the gas network to check for a leak... then i will report the engineers commision report on here then it will be npower to check meter...

All i get is dont worry ..... i m worrying a full new systen and canny afford to turn it on

 

[SimonJohns]

just spoke to heating engineers he said there is no leak and boiler has been commisioned and checked out and hes still to fill in the paperwork.he said the boiler is a 37kwh so its impossible to burn more than that.......

i have contacted the gas network to check for a leak... then i will report the engineers commision report on here then it will be npower to check meter...

All i get is dont worry ..... i m worrying a full new systen and canny afford to turn it on

What other gas appliances do you have in your home?

 

[SimonJohns]

Just out of curiosity. I've been doing some maths

I would say the boiler is working at 26kw

Do you have a round dial on your meter. Looks a bit like a clock?

 

[Foxyuk]

What other gas appliances do you have in your home?

none so far

 

[Foxyuk]

Just out of curiosity. I've been doing some maths

I would say the boiler is working at 26kw

Do you have a round dial on your meter. Looks a bit like a clock?

no mine was fitted in 2009 its large plastic thing with 8 numbers, 3 being after the decimal point

 

[Mbear]

no mine was fitted in 2009 its large plastic thing with 8 numbers, 3 being after the decimal point

Can u do a gas rate check and we can calculate it for u?

Get a stopwatch, turn on the hot water tap, start the stop watch whilst noting the last 3 digits, then 120secs later note down the last 3 digits. It u get us they no.s then we can do the calc for u. This will give a correct gas rate reading. Basically it should be slightly less than the kw rating on the data badge. Is if 37kw boiler then it'll usually gas rate at between 32 and 36kw

 

[CES]

Foxy, Do an accurate recording of readings using a stopwatch and 2 mins apart, according to your last two readings (after a bit of interpolation) it would appear to be burning double its max rate of 4m3/hr which isn't right. In order to confirm what is actually happening these two readings need to be as accurate as possible.
As for saying that everything will be ok, don't take the installers word for it until he has given you all the paperwork and filled in the Benchmark.

 

[Foxyuk]

Foxy, Do an accurate recording of readings using a stopwatch and 2 mins apart, according to your last two readings (after a bit of interpolation) it would appear to be burning double its max rate of 4m3/hr which isn't right. In order to confirm what is actually happening these two readings need to be as accurate as possible.
As for saying that everything will be ok, don't take the installers word for it until he has given you all the paperwork and filled in the Benchmark.

ok thanks.... just been to house there is no gas leak as scottish network been out , he did point out that maybe the boiler needs ranged for size of house etc.... im in a 2.3 bed bungalow original, 7 radiators 92 sqm in total..... i will do the water test tomorrow morning and report ......

hey ces !!! fancy a beer at mine not far away from me :svengo:....

 

[doitmyself]

scottish network been out , he did point out that maybe the boiler needs ranged for size of house etc.... im in a 2.3 bed bungalow original, 7 radiators 92 sqm in total

That's a valid point. An 837 has a heating output of 28kW, which is much more than a typical 2/3 bed bungalow will require. Also, seven rads will not add up to any more than 14 kW.

Who decided that you needed a 37kW boiler - you or the installer?

Did the installer measure the incoming cold water flow rate?

Use Whole House Boiler Size Calculator to find out your heating requirement (set the Domestic Hot Water Allowance to 0 as you have a combi boiler). Then get the installer to range-rate the boiler to slightly more than this.

 

[Deleted member 32524]

Why not get him to show you how to gas rate and what the readings are.

 

[doitmyself]

Just out of curiosity. I've been doing some maths

I would say the boiler is working at 26kw

Please may we see your calculation?

 

[SimonJohns]

Please may we see your calculation?

Treat your answers as imperial

 

[armourer]

Range rate the boiler, It may not need the full output?

 

[justalex81]

boiler fitted is an ecotec plus 837 by the sounds of it. This boiler does not require range rating as it modulates from 5kw. As this is a combi boiler i'd guess that the op wanted a high output of hot water (837 offers approx 15L/m), and is the reason why an 837 was chosen. Your engineer should have gas rated the appliance as part of commisioning and should have picked up on any anomalies. If the calculations are correct then something is not right.

Get your engineer to check pressure at meter when appliance is running. could be a fault with the regulator on the meter.

 

[Foxyuk]

boiler fitted is an ecotec plus 837 by the sounds of it. This boiler does not require range rating as it modulates from 5kw. As this is a combi boiler i'd guess that the op wanted a high output of hot water (837 offers approx 15L/m), and is the reason why an 837 was chosen. Your engineer should have gas rated the appliance as part of commisioning and should have picked up on any anomalies. If the calculations are correct then something is not right.

Get your engineer to check pressure at meter when appliance is running. could be a fault with the regulator on the meter.

hi there not been up to do the test as suggested previously ie run hot water for 1 minute then post a reading..... also been told to turn heating on for 2 mins take a reading then straight away time the next 2 mins and post figs here.


had the gas board checking metet for leaks and house area nothing, he said unlikely meter fauly ... the engineer went out yesterday to fit hob and said that its self modulating as you said and u should not touch anything. at moment my bath is getting installed so he said until thats done you cant do a full test etc is that correct??

when you say check pressure at meter when running what do you mean?

 

[peteheat]

Hi,

Why did you give the job to that man?

It is clear that you don't trust him questioning his work before the job is presented to you as completed.

I know if I was him and the Gas Board was called in before I was finished you would be looking for another contractor!

If the contractor is registered you have a load of consumer rights to fall back on, if you are using an apprentice, diy or unregistered contractor (which is how this thread appears to me) now you know the benefit of using registered contractors.