Are "we" (plumbers) tight?

[MarieHigham]

Hey Lads,

I just got back from a christmas function with the family and one of my cousins friends were there and we got chatting and to be honest, there is only so much christmas one can talk about before it becomes dull and we started talking about our careers. He is a web designer and when I told him I was a plumber he was *strike through text*surprised*strike through text* his response was "aren't you too attractive to be a plumber". I said no, being a plumber will generate a lot of money. This is when he started pmsl himself laughing.

We had the conversation and his argueement was based upon the fact every plumber he has come across are (in his words) too tight to pay for anything or just too poor. When I told him how much money I was spending and based that on how much I want to earn he understood and continued to say that not all plumbers had the same ideology. My own being if I spend £1 I want £3 back.

However to back him up, when in another post I mentioned how much I was spending I got a response via my inbox.

Hi

Dont spend too much on website. They are good to have but can be expensive and not good enough to rely on as a main source of generating business.

Have a look at mine

[link removed to protect id of person who sent mail - admin can confirm this is true though right?]

My mate designs sites for free and charges monthly 60 quid for all the seo work which is what gets your website onto first page of google and keeps you there.

I also have a few other tips for generating business which I will go into when I have more time.

Good luck
***

The point of this thread being... How do you see it? Would you spend £1 if you saw £3 back??

Marie x

 

[Killy Bing]

Hmm, maybe too tight with web designers!
For us it seems websites only generate so much work which quite often ends up with time wasters.

so of course we don't want to spend a huge amount on it.

i haven't made one (i can to an alright standard)
i prefer to build up through word of mouth.

 

[helpsy]

I spent £150 for my first page and then the lad charged me £60 for the second. Total £210 and no monthly layout. It seems to be doing good. Simon Helps - reliable and friendly plumber serving Bath and North West Wiltshire Have a look if you like, most people I know say it's good.

 

[MarieHigham]

I spent £150 for my first page and then the lad charged me £60 for the second. Total £210 and no monthly layout. It seems to be doing good. [can#t post link] Have a look if you like, most people I know say it's good.

I'd want a few more pages for £210, the design isn't bad and his wet room one (i checked the guy out) the wet room website looks alright. I'm paying £60 an hour at the moment to my web designer and around £500 per month for search engine work and £200 per month when website is done for google advertisement. I'm hoping for boiler work in the evening and some bathroom work during the day.

 

[Killy Bing]

I spent £150 for my first page and then the lad charged me £60 for the second. Total £210 and no monthly layout. It seems to be doing good. Simon Helps - reliable and friendly plumber serving Bath and North West Wiltshire Have a look if you like, most people I know say it's good.

Look whos a pretty boy!

 

[turnpin]

Looks good to me tells a lot without the overkill some can have...regards Turnpin:17:

 

[kay-jay]

Spending a pound hopimg to get three back is low risk.
However for a new business spending 2k hoping to get 6k back is high risk.

Many of us have websites but none of us rely on them as a primary source of work. Spending more money on a website does not necessarily equate to better results. It is an industry awash with charlatans and cowboys eager to take your cash. All promise the earth, few deliver.

Beware of contracts, being tied to contractual payments for 2 years for an innefective source of work can be soul destroying.

Tread carefully it can be a minefield.

My site is cheap and generates about 5-6 quid per 1 spent.


Hope this helps.

 

[MarieHigham]

Hey Thanks Kev.

I was thinking about using directories, the lad designing my website wrote a contract but the contract is unique in the sense that all other web designers wanted a contract that stated I paid them between £50 - £5,000 per month (I mean there were a few agencies I approached) anyway, this lad wrote a contract that said that unless i (as in me not him) meet specific targets of customers I do not pay him or I pay him only on a "drink" basis (essentially i chuck him a few quid if i don't meet customer target.

But truth be told, I only signed up to his service on the basis he has built a ratedpeople / freeindex type of website. Which leads me on to ask about freeindex? Loads of plumbers use it and pay the £10 per month but is it worth it in terms of leads or just good for building trust as i searched some google listings and some stars appear next to listing based on reviews like when you type in films and stars appear on google based on reviews from website.

 

[IDCHAPPY]

Rated people isn't too bad for work, starting samll on it to get some decent feedback then possibly moving on to bigger projects when your happier doing them

 

[Ray Stafford]

I think there are a couple of other variables.

Firstly, how much work are you currently getting by other, cheaper, means? If you are getting x hours per week from an advertising method that only costs £1 per £20 of work generated, then it would be foolish to spend money on a method that cost £1 per £3 of work, unless you were absolutely sure that the first method was already yielding its maximum and couldn't be extended, and that there was no in between method.

Secondly, you need to look at your business overheads and separate out your fixed and variable costs. There may be some work that simply isn't worth taking once you factor in a cost of 30% on advertising simply to acquire it. Your billable hours are revenue, not profit, and £1 purely on advertising cost (before travel and other variable costs) to generate £3 worth of revenue sounds very expensive to me.

Web designers, SEO experts and all the rest are just advertising salesmen - no different to the ones who want to sell you space in yellow pages or thomson local. (does that still exist?). Their proposals should never be looked at in isolation. You should always look at the "opportunity cost" - ie what else could I spend this money on that might be more effective or beneficial?

 

[kay-jay]

I have had a couple of decent jobs off freeindex.
I dont pay the 27p per day or whatever it is. Just the free listing.

It can be useful to check in and chase work if your quiet.

 

[MarieHigham]

See I don't mind sending someone money in exchange for work that is just showing love and showing love is important. I mean if I get a bathroom job and my wage (not total cost) is £500 for a week or whatever I charge I'd happily send someone £50 - £75 to say thanks - my boss used to send money to loads of people that got him work. Occasionally he'd send money even if he didn't get the job just to have them remember him for next time. Is this common in this industry or was Jason a one off?

Marie x

 

[kay-jay]

See I don't mind sending someone money in exchange for work that is just showing love and showing love is important. I mean if I get a bathroom job and my wage (not total cost) is £500 for a week or whatever I charge I'd happily send someone £50 - £75 to say thanks - my boss used to send money to loads of people that got him work. Occasionally he'd send money even if he didn't get the job just to have them remember him for next time. Is this common in this industry or was Jason a one off?

Marie x

Pretty common and it can help ensure the work rolls in. Usually at a higher level though like developers taking planning officers on golf holidays in portugal .....if you're go na do it Just dont give out more than you can afford.
I wouldnt reccomend taking it out of your own pocket as such. But on a bathroom job you can lose the expense on other trades by sticking 20 on the plastering, tiling etc.

Its more usual at our level to reccomend our mates and be reccomended in return rather than chuck a drink at each other unless its a bit one sided.

I usually tip some of the other trades or buy a bottle at xmas not for work in return as such but to ensure that if I need em at short notice its someone else who gets dropped and my job runs on schedule.

 

[efficiencyman]

Well I must have been "tight " for 50 years I am pleased to say that I have never paid to advertise at all and no internet fees. In most of that time it`s been "hectic" with work, missing bank holidays etc.
I do not believe ads should be needed, if a good customer base of satisfied, contented clients who know of a good local tradesman who turns up as promised, does a reliable job, for a reasonable price. That`s what brings in the work a customer base of thousands who recommend me, if you need to pay "touts" for leads then something is adrift in your work ethics.
Each to there own but recommendation has worked for me.

 

[Ray Stafford]

I wouldn't go so far as efficiencyman, but he has a fair point. By far the best advertisment is good quality work and happy customers.

The two are not the same - its possible to do an excellent job from an engineering perspective, but leave unhappy customers because of poor people skills.

We do a lot of advertising when we move to a new area, but very little advertising in areas where we have been active for a while. If business takes a turn for the worse in an area where we have a long standing presence, we wouldn't look at advertising - we would be wondering what had gone wrong with our product/price/service in that area.

 

[wetdrip]

I'd want a few more pages for £210, the design isn't bad and his wet room one (i checked the guy out) the wet room website looks alright. I'm paying £60 an hour at the moment to my web designer and around £500 per month for search engine work and £200 per month when website is done for google advertisement. I'm hoping for boiler work in the evening and some bathroom work during the day.

I can help you out with, i think, with sound advice, but your PM box is full.
First and foremost go here: https://www.123-reg.co.uk/domain-names/ and purchase the domain name www.manchesterplumbingandgas.co.uk

DO IT NOW!

 

[MarieHigham]

I can help you out with, i think, with sound advice, but your PM box is full.
First and foremost go here: https://www.123-reg.co.uk/domain-names/ and purchase the domain name www.manchesterplumbingandgas.co.uk

DO IT NOW!

I just rang my guy and he said that domain names like that aren't good because they're non branded, too long and generic. I already have a domain name lined up for the website.

Thanks for advice though x

Marie x

 

[MarieHigham]

Actually my web designer just e-mailed me this ebay link.

Plumbers Central London Website for Sale - with 55 places on 1st Page of Google! | eBay

he said if I wanted to waste money I should buy that website - it is worthless, the keywords it is on page 1 for aren't typed in to Google and is easy to do with a budget of £500 a simple website with a url of emergency plumbers in the town or city and it would be on page one anyway and if you type in emergency Plumber london the website isn't there because it is a keyword everyone wants.

 

[wetdrip]

Actually my web designer just e-mailed me this ebay link.

Plumbers Central London Website for Sale - with 55 places on 1st Page of Google! | eBay

he said if I wanted to waste money I should buy that website - it is worthless, the keywords it is on page 1 for aren't typed in to Google and is easy to do with a budget of £500 a simple website with a url of emergency plumbers in the town or city and it would be on page one anyway and if you type in emergency Plumber london the website isn't there because it is a keyword everyone wants.

It's SERPS that are important.
You're based in Manchester not London, hence www.manchesterplumbingandgas.co.uk keywords and meta's are not anywhere near as important as good individual "RELEVANT" page content.Page content is the mustard.


Below is the title and description used in the site you mentioned earlier, just apply something similar for the manchester domain name I mentioned.

<head>
	<title>Emergency Plumbers Central London | Plumbing Company Central London | Plumbing Services Central London</title>
	<meta name="Description" content="Emergency Plumbers Central London. Our plumbing company in Central London provide quality plumbing services in Central London.
	" />

 

[helpsy]

Look whos a pretty boy!

Amazing what photoshop can do....I normally look like Keith Richards! Lol

 

[kirkgas]

Amazing what photoshop can do....I normally look like Keith Richards! Lol

I think keith would sue you for that comment

 

[village idiot]

If you are just starting up, you'd be better off doing as IDCHAPPY said! Instead of spending that much money on advertising, just get a basic website (to get web presence) then sign up to places like: Rated People, MyBuilder, .... etc. Better to just choose one of them. Considering your labour charges (too low), you will do well with such organisations. I say so as I believe a majority of customers who use them only do so as their intention is to get the cheapest quote for the job. For established trades people, joining such an organisation is a waste of time. But i know of many that do. Then again,if you have staff that need paying, you may be tempted to get them any work, especially if it covers your overheads.

 

[tamz]

I don't have a web page and have no real intentions of ever getting one although i do have the domain name. I don't do any buy a job for the lowest bidder sites sites either.
I just looked at google a minute ago for local plumbers in my area (not 1 local I recognised but the nationals and a few big players from the cities were there too). There were maybe 20 results (never counted) on page 1. It's amazing how every web design guy (or girl) can get you on page 1 :smile:
Methinks there is more money to be made ripping off the plumbers selling stuff than there is in doing the actual work.

 

[Ray Stafford]

Methinks there is more money to be made ripping off the plumbers selling stuff than there is in doing the actual work.

Aye.

Consider this.

If every single plumber in the country stopped advertising tomorrow, would there be a single less leaking tap, new bathroom install or boiler swap to be done?

Answer - nope!

 

[lame plumber]

See I don't mind sending someone money in exchange for work that is just showing love and showing love is important. I mean if I get a bathroom job and my wage (not total cost) is £500 for a week or whatever I charge I'd happily send someone £50 - £75 to say thanks - my boss used to send money to loads of people that got him work. Occasionally he'd send money even if he didn't get the job just to have them remember him for next time. Is this common in this industry or was Jason a one off?

Marie x

more commom with the Mafia than plumbers