bermuda back boiler and fire, ID ..

[mcniven]

Hi guys,

Went to a do a Landlord Cert today on a back boiler and fire.
Flue flow test was good. When carrying out the spillage test on the fire
I noticed the smoke pouring out around the glass (rope seal) and the back
coming back into the room!

They told me (polish) 'its okay its okay we dont use the fire' :/
I phoned gas safe to ask 'if i put the 3 way valve to boiler only, and keep the non live end
of the fire still connected (but with no supply) - can i keep the boiler on?'
straight up 'NO ID THE APPLIANCE'

So thats done, then the landlord (letting agency) are on giving it, 'thats unreal, how can u ID that they wont have any heating or hw'

............... LOL????

 

[Rickster123]

Done your job mate. Always cover your arse. I'm sure the landlord would thank you if he realised the possible alternatives! As long as my heatings working I'm a happy man!

 

[AWheating]

if the landlord was that concerned about the lack of heating then suggest they pop around with some electric heaters until the problem is solved.

 

[SimonJohns]

Technically the 3 way valve is a user operated valve. So who's to say they couldn't put the fire back on after you've left.

I would of deffo ID that

 

[diamondgas]

Personally I'd have turned the 3 way to boiler only and told the custard they carn't use the fire! Slapped a label on for safe measure!
That's just me .. There may well have been no need IMO to leave the customer without central heating in this weather when you knew the boiler was working safely and I asume the custard was totaly oblivious to the valve in question!!! Isolating the fire via the 3 way, unless the custard knows the appliance inside out, is pretty darn safe! IMO ... I'm not a TOFO engineer thankfully and I feel can make tenants understand safety! A great deal don't trust their Landlords and are dubvious of what they say; when a professional such as you and I says don't use though the vast majority take notice and those that don't get filtered out as 'useless' by humainities gene pool as humainly as possible IMHO :lol:

 

[tamz]

How and from where did you spillage test the fire from? Sounds like you did it from the wrong place. Most baxi's are done from the boiler flue hood.

You could have capped the fire pipe with a 10mm compression cap.

 

[mcniven]

tamz smoke was coming out from the glass surround and rising the flue was hot so was deffinatly not a cold flue with no pull

 

[GrahamM]

Out of interest. What was the exact model fire/bbu and where did you do spill from?
Did you test the spill of the boiler itself? If that was drawing fine, as tamz mentioned, you could have capped the fire off itself.

 

[mcniven]

baxi bermuda, dont know exact fire model, i would of had to cut the 10m offset stainless steel pipe to fire then only power boiler, the flue flow test was ok, terminating fine.

it was the glass front fire, i had no MI, i put the match at usuall looking test points which all spilled, but when i put the actull fire on the smoke was coming out from the glass's seal! its easy to say over the internet id of passed that, but when u turn around and see a 5 month baby on the couch, its not so easy to... im only protecting myself.

 

[Billy Bob Bob]

baxi bermuda, dont know exact fire model, i would of had to cut the 10m offset stainless steel pipe to fire then only power boiler, the flue flow test was ok, terminating fine.

it was the glass front fire, i had no MI, i put the match at usuall looking test points which all spilled, but when i put the actull fire on the smoke was coming out from the glass's seal! its easy to say over the internet id of passed that, but when u turn around and see a 5 month baby on the couch, its not so easy to... im only protecting

myself.

there are two spillage test points on a Bermuda fire,as tamz pointed out its either via the draft hood divertor(bbu flue hood) or dependent on fire type theres a small test point on the lh side of the fire heat exchanger where did you test? i have fitted millions of burmudas there should not be smoke under any circumstances leaking past the fire glass as the test points are above this to me this suggests a flue restriction

 

[GrahamM]

In absence of MI's, if you are 100% sure you carried out you spill from correct point and it failed, you acted correctly.
Just very unusual for a baxi back boiler unit to fail a spill when carried out correctly in my experience. Can't honestly say when I last had one; and there is some weeks I am doing loads.

 

[Billy Bob Bob]

In absence of MI's, if you are 100% sure you carried out you spill from correct point and it failed, you acted correctly.
Just very unusual for a baxi back boiler unit to fail a spill when carried out correctly in my experience. Can't honestly say when I last had one; and there is some weeks I am doing loads.

me too,last one i had was a partly crushed liner boiler would pass but it could not handle the fire working as well

 

[mcniven]

there are two spillage test points on a Bermuda fire,as tamz pointed out its either via the draft hood divertor(bbu flue hood) or dependent on fire type theres a small test point on the lh side of the fire heat exchanger where did you test? i have fitted millions of burmudas there should not be smoke under any circumstances leaking past the fire glass as the test points are above this to me this suggests a flue restriction

def no flue restriction. flue flow was completely fine.

 

[mcniven]

smoke coming from the seal around glass front, gas man. would u not ID?

 

[Billy Bob Bob]

smoke coming from the seal around glass front, gas man. would u not ID?

no i would ID where did you test?and by pass the flue flow then the bbu often will but not the spilage when both are going if theres a flue fault

 

[tamz]

If it was a glass fronted one like a VP or GF or whatever the fire is spillage tested as shown here

Radiant types like PW's have the test carried out here, Not at the radiants.

You need the outer case off them to test.


Easy to get confused if you don't know them.

 

[mcniven]

thats exactly it tam the first picture, and i was around about that area, i couldnt see an obvious point and without MI didnt really know where to test, but when i seen the smoke at the glass coming out, i wasnt confident enough to pass that ???

 

[tamz]

Your made the call as you saw it. Nobody will shoot you for that. Better safe than sorry.

 

[mcniven]

how do u get a hold of the info so quickly when on the frontline do u carry ipads or something ?

 

[Billy Bob Bob]

thats exactly it tam the first picture, and i was around about that area, i couldnt see an obvious point and without MI didnt really know where to test, but when i seen the smoke at the glass coming out, i wasnt confident enough to pass that ???

i cant see how if you tested in the flue hood smoke came out of the fire glass,as your testing above the glass,you do need to put the match holder in a fair way though

 

[Billy Bob Bob]

how do u get a hold of the info so quickly when on the frontline do u carry ipads or something ?

whats a eye pad?dont A+E do them?

 

[tamz]

I fitted probably thousands of them so can do them blindfolded.

 

[mcniven]

Monumental iPad SLAP ! - YouTube

 

[Billy Bob Bob]

I fitted probably thousands of them so can do them blindfolded.

me too experience i think was the word we where looking for,easy for us to say though i started my career when 551,552,401 where king most combis were ferroli 77 ff or worcs 9.24

 

[Kev the gas]

Hi guys,

Went to a do a Landlord Cert today on a back boiler and fire.
Flue flow test was good. When carrying out the spillage test on the fire
I noticed the smoke pouring out around the glass (rope seal) and the back
coming back into the room!

Evening chaps, from the replies Ive read so far everyone is presuming the Flue flow test was good!!

mcnivens, was the Flue flow test carried with the smoke pellet in draught diverter or near the burner?

Personally I would go back and check the following :-

Remove fire

Check burner pressure on boiler only.

smoke pellet in near burner
smoke pellet in draught diverter
Repeat both with burner on and off.

If all work well, I would fire the boiler and hold a smoke pellet approx 75mm away from draught diverter, if it pulls well I would be looking at a fire fault.

If so I would refit the fire but disconnect and gas and investigate if a fire replacement is possible, but would recommend a new boiler replacement elsewhere.

I would also try and place a smoke pellet into the back boiler burner after connecting the fire just to be safe.