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Discuss Boiler above sink!!! in the Boilers area at Plumbers Forums

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Hi all
I always keep my old boiler chained to the sink the chain is a 100mm long and it saves me having to talk to her.
seriosly though I think its another case of us and them, If any of us installed this boiler I dont doubt that a bg engineer would condem it and we would be hounded by the HSE, because it was installed by BG, its perfectly ok.
regards
Mike

Hi all
I always keep my old boiler chained to the sink the chain is a 100mm long and it saves me having to talk to her.
seriosly though I think its another case of us and them, If any of us installed this boiler I dont doubt that a bg engineer would condem it and we would be hounded by the HSE, because it was installed by BG, its perfectly ok.
regards
Mike
 
Last edited:
Hi all
I always keep my old boiler chained to the sink the chain is a 100mm long and it saves me having to talk to her.



I haven’t talked to my wife for two years now because I was taught in was rude to interrupt! :D
 
I will advice you base ..The boiler has been installed by a Corgi 2 years ago.. And if you can look at it..The minimum clearance I think is 400mm above the sink..So I dont know why if someone will service the boiler ,you told me he will condemed it? NO.I will ask you For FREE..Call the gas safe register customer services ask informations regarding the problems, Or ask a spection engineer from them..for FREE..They will come to sort it out your problems..The british gas who installed still they responsible..they cant go or hide..The records is in data base for 10 years..so you are cover??ok ...Where about you are?area? I am small corgi base here in West london
Cheeers
vdc
 
BG sub contract gas work, so it doesn't mean its fitting directly by them, i agree about giving safe safe a call and have an inspection.
 
Hmm

Seems most of us have reservations about the position of the boiler?

But why?

Basically because we all probably thinks its a bit dodgy and where it is fixed is in a bit of a grey area as regards Regs. In other words its a bit iffy!

Being cautious I would advocate on the side of safety even if it means exceeding the Regs
I don't know about you, but I feel fitting an RCD if the boiler can't be moved is in fact enhancing the safety aspects of the 17th Edition of the Wiring Regs and playing it safe. Which is what an inspector would probably look for in the event of an accident in a grey area. And lets not forget you would be the patsy who takes the responsibility if it never came up to standard.
They can't touch you if you exceed Regs. And lets not forget lots of Regs and Standards are probably the product of things that have gone wrong in the past and somebody has decide to do something about it.
Don't forget Regs are also usually only the minimum requirements, you can exceed them.
Lets be honest "How many people do you hear of, who have been done for exceeding safety requirement levels?"
There are probably many that have been done for not meeting them though.

Okay fair enough, I've worked in places where a landlord or homeowner may not want to pay a penny more than they where required too by law. And that is where the real problem lies I suppose? Its okay exceeding the regs but who pays for the extra safety?
The angle I was coming from was, that nearly all domestic electrical sockets that can be used by an ordinary person will be required, in new build and probably new installation, to be protected by 30mA RCD's in the new 17th Edition of The Wiring Regs.
If you where a central heating engineer and placed a boiler in a Kitchen, let's be honest you ain't going to get an electrician to install the electrics if you don't have too. So the chances are, you may want to use one of the existing sockets for a boiler and system feed.

Beside that its easier to use a socket and plug for basic testing afterwards and for isolation.

Your not very likely to supply and fit a new corded wall outlet, which in point may make the boiler classed as hard wired and the only person who can isolate the supply would be a professional or trained person not an ordinary person.

Fitting a corded outlet, although simple and the face plates are cheap, it may cost a bomb, because if your not recognised as a competent person under Part P of the Building Regs able to self certify your own installation work, you would have to get a Building Control guy to come out and certify it for you, or get a registered contractor to do it for you and pay their prices.
The Kitchen is an area mentioned in Part P as being out of bounds unless the work is certified.
So the chances are you would use an existing socket and save all that mucking about.

Incidentally you would have to ensure you checked the socket before you fitted anything to it. And that means its "earth loop" value as well as its polarity.

And keep a record that you had.

Its no use using an ordinary plug top tester, all they tell you is that the socket has an earth not how much current it can take, it may have a bell wire for an earth and if you get a 230v fault what good is a protective earth that burns out at 12 volts.

You can get plug top tester's that do a basic earth loop test and ones that do an RCD test, as well as all the usual tests.

They are about £40 + plus each. Using one of those would be better than plugging in and hoping. In point some boiler manufacturers probably ask you to test the earth loop before you fit their boilers.

I must ask a "Spark" some time whether the new plug top testers, that test RCD or earth loop comply as being sufficient to show you have checked.

Anyway hope this helps somebody, you can check it all out if you like, in the Building Regs or IEE 17th Edition. In point I would advise you to do so, don't take my word for it, I can be wrong and often am. But I think you will find its not far off and if it makes you look it up and check it all out, its perhaps done both of us some good.
 
 
very interesting read bernie,
did exactly one of those today.
got a jolt of the casing today from the socket next to it., found loose wiring inside causing grounding.
 
Hi
So this is gas safe answer /pass the buck


The location of a boiler above a sink would be a non preferred location. If this was the only location we would recommend that the advice of the proposed boiler manufacturer be consulted for advice regarding this position. It may be that some manufacturers may be conserved about steam or condensation forming inside the electronics section of the appliance with may result in damage to the appliance.

I trust this answers your question.



And this is baxi two cock up reply

1th

Thank you for your enquiry.

The positioning of the boiler depends on the IPX rating of the boiler which
is in the boiler installation instructions technical manual. This IPX
rating will determine how close the boiler can be positioned to a basin,
sink bath and so on.

It is the installers responsibility to check this information or refer to
their electrical engineer. Further information is in the IEE Wiring
Regulations.



2nd

I have found out the IPX code is for boiler fitted in bathrooms only. As
yours is fitted in the kitchen it is not a requirement so you can ignore
the information I gave you earlier.

So they don't know .
you can install a boiler above sink just put a shelf under it or a cupboard .
No law! / no body's with the answer
 
Err!

Some years ago I was investigating "How to write a Plumbing report" one piece of advice was "Never ever say Yes or No in the report" but always "It appears".

The reason being, by saying "It appears" only means you think it is, which in law is an opinion not a stated fact, which means you could be wrong and by saying "It appears" you are indicating you could be wrong. And so cannot be held responsible under law if you are wrong.

In other words you don't say "The pipe is burst because of frost" that is a statement of fact. What you say is "It appears the pipe may have burst through frost"

As was said, worded one way a customer could sue you over a report, worded the other they couldn't.
 
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