Copper water cylinder needs replacing??

[paul wenman]

Our indirect copper water cyclinder has started leaking. Not a flood but enough to wet the whole floor in the airing cupboard. Could not find any obvious leaks from pipe joints, shower pump etc. so called in a plumber. He cut away insulation layer at bottom and found heavy corrosion. He has recomended a replacement. I was surprised because I did not know copper cylinders corroded seriously - he said it would be caused by accumulated limescale deposits - we are in a hard water area and the tank is over 20 hyears old, maybe 30 (already here when we moved in).

I would like to be sure that this really is the tank gone, as opposed to the pipe joint at the bottom. Can anyone offer their views please? These pics are odd angles - the pipe is entering the tank bottom right.

Thanks

 

[Dkdc71]

Yeah that's them we had the Irish version you could buy them in copper craft

 

[Dkdc71]

That was when the hot water was heated through a direct cylinder coming from the copper box boiler in the fire cradle .them copper boxes were great for scrapping very thick copper plenty of weight in them a direct cylinder is unheard of nowadays

 

[Best]

Funny how some job tasks have now disappeared from plumbing work.
And other new tasks are with modern plumbing.

 

[Best]

That was when the hot water was heated through a direct cylinder coming from the copper box boiler in the fire cradle .them copper boxes were great for scrapping very thick copper plenty of weight in them a direct cylinder is unheard of nowadays

Yes, nearly every house years ago that was getting a heating system installed, only had a direct cylinder linked to a solid fuel little back boiler, or some had a glass fronted room heater that only had small back boiler. Rayburn 70B I think was a very common glass fronted fire

 

[ShaunCorbs]

anyone know when the immersion coil heaters off the heating came out (with the big bakerlight housing) ?

 

[Dkdc71]

Old ways are tried and trusted a good copper job beats anything , soon apprentice's are not getting the proper training in good copper work the nickname some are getting is plastic plumbers had a lad just out of his time tell me there is no need for a safety valve on a solid fuel boiler his instructor in their course told the class this only needed an expansion .. Told him why didn't he ask why they made safety valves in the first place self explanatory I told him the clue is in the name SAFETY lol

 

[Dkdc71]

We were told the immersions came out in the 70,s Shaun

 

[Best]

Old ways are tried and trusted a good copper job beats anything , soon apprentice's are not getting the proper training in good copper work the nickname some are getting is plastic plumbers had a lad just out of his time tell me there is no need for a safety valve on a solid fuel boiler his instructor in their course told the class this only needed an expansion .. Told him why didn't he ask why they made safety valves in the first place self explanatory I told him the clue is in the name SAFETY lol

To be honest I never have installed a safety valve on solid fuel systems. If proper done and sized vent and feed pipes are installed and no pipes are vulnerable to freezing, then really no need for a PRV. But if the vent and feed in a loft froze, then a PRV close to the boiler would be definitely worth having. I don't really see the point in a PRV in a loft.
Obviously if MIs state it must be installed, then I would fit one.

 

[Dkdc71]

Think your taking up what I said wrong best . I would never put a prv valve in a loft always at the boiler. I wouldn't fit any boiler without one solid fuel is always an open system feed and expansion but always a prv is required at boiler off 28 mm as near to the boiler as possible got called to a job not too long ago no safety valve boiler making a lot of noise piped wrong no safety valve guy that fitted it couldn't stop it pitching into f and e tank so the genius capped it . he is giving the rest of is a bad name doing work like that a potential bomb he left not saying you are wrong but we were always taught any boiler requires a safety valve except the old direct hot water gravity system that expanded through cylinder expansion if needed

 

[Best]

Think your taking up what I said wrong best . ......

No, I wasn't thinking you had suggested about putting PRV on solid fuel systems in lofts. I was just speaking generally about my thoughts on using PRVs and mentioned their position was important to be close to the boiler, if they are to be a proper safety belt and braces addition.
I still think PRVs are unnecessary on a properly done solid fuel system, but they will do absolutely no harm to have that additional safety, providing obviously the discharge is put to a safe exit and I would be happy to fit one on a cold leg. It will never function though, unless someone allows a house to totally freeze in severe weather and then go in and light the solid fuel boiler. More likely the PRV will seize or begin to pass water due to the heat damage and need replacing.
The solid fuel on direct cylinders ironically are actually more dangerous because the connections can block eventually, whereas indirect systems will not block, so should be safe and always open to the vent and feed.
I guess it is just whoever teaches you, or what system diagrams you copy, as to our methods.

 

[Dkdc71]

Yeah your right just brought that memory off them blocking one of the first nixers I ever done was replacing one and haven't to drill the copper firebox to drain it jaysus that was a really long time ago lol thanks for the memory

 

[Best]

Yeah your right just brought that memory off them blocking one of the first nixers I ever done was replacing one and haven't to drill the copper firebox to drain it jaysus that was a really long time ago lol thanks for the memory

I remember getting a phone call about a really old range cooker (heated hot water only) behaving strangely. Then the owner mentioned the flow and return had reversed to cold and hot.
It was direct connected to cylinder and connections in the cooker had blocked near solid. Had to be cleared with a metal bar, flushed and then changed over to the much superior indirect cylinder method and inhibitor added obviously.
Certainly was becoming dangerous

 

[Dkdc71]

One of the worst blockages I came across over the years was an overflow from domestic water tank blocked solid with lime the last 12 inches out through the soffit of the house had overflowed internally had got up to check tank and overflow disconnected the 3/4 inch copper pipe and the weight in the bottom start falling out through the soffit householder hadn't noticed any extra water as it was discharging over their lawn thought they might have heard tank filling at night lol kept the pipe for years to show others never seen anything like it since

 

[Best]

In my area we are so fortunate to not have lime in our water. Tanks and electric showers stay fairly clean

 

[Dkdc71]

There is lime in my area not too bad kettles average 2 or 3 years had a triton in my en-suite got 13 years out of it small bit in bottom of tank but that's it really most areas in Ireland have a bit of lime the ones I feel sorry for is if they have iron in the water.. Brown water and if really bad smelly plasterer's in the last house we done brought their own water because of smell when mixing and the plaster would not go off for them owner had to get a fairly elaborate filter system fitted was charged about 7000 for it by a well drilling company