Employee Broken Wrist Outside of Work

[cr0ft]

Hi all,

One of our tradesmen has broken his wrist outside of work. It's going to be in plaster for a good few weeks now and obviously during this time he isn't going to be able to do any construction work for us!

My main concern is ensuring that it heals up ASAP. He wants to come in and get the apprentice he works with doing the work and him supervising it. I have three issues with this though: -

1.) I can't afford to pay him tradesman's rates to have him watching an apprentice do work at a much slower speed.

2.) If he injures himself or someone else further on site then surely I am as a boss liable for allowing him back to work?

3.) He can't drive a van anyway in a plaster cast and the 17 year old apprentice isn't insured on any of our vans for obvious reasons.

My gut instinct is to put him on SSP until such time as he gets a fit-note to return to work. Any employers out there with experience of this who would deal with this in a different way?

Thanks for all advice.

 

[hammers4spanner]

``Common sense says SSP

 

[Ray Stafford]

Depends on length of service.

Contractually we reserve the right to just pay SSP, but in reality we pay full sick pay (but not overtime or bonuses) for a period which increases with length of service. That allows you to build up a "reserve" and we find it pays dividends to look after loyal staff. Having said that, if someone joined us in January and then went long term sick in March, it would be SSP all the way.

 

[SimonG]

SSP for me. He'll be signed off work with his sick note. Shouldn't work until he has been signed off the sick by a doctor.

Opens up a can of worms if you let him on site as far as insurances etc go.

 

[mfgs]

I don't think it would be wise to have him back working on site, if he hurts himself it will be your fault. Keep him off work until he is fully healed and fit to work.

 

[Ray Stafford]

If you do opt for him to come on site, do a risk assessment of what he is and isn't allowed to do, and get him to sign for it.

 

[cr0ft]

If you do opt for him to come on site, do a risk assessment of what he is and isn't allowed to do, and get him to sign for it.

Hmm. After just doing a wee spot of checking on Facebook too try and work out if the injury was drink induced (tripped over and fell, the employee likes a drink) I found something a bit more disturbing.

A while back the lad damaged a £700 bath which I paid for to avoid him having to. The bath was going to cost £250 to repair and even then it would not be guaranteed and so I asked this employee to simply take the bath down to the recycling centre and get rid of it.

It turns out that this supervisor actually has taken the bath elsewhere, another employee was chatting to him on Facebook and suggested he had stolen the bath, to which he replied 'it's a nice bath'. To my mind if he was going to use/sell it he should have asked me and I would have told him to give me any money he got from it, given that I saved him having to pay for the replacement in the first place.

The issue here for me is he has lost all integrity now for me as he has disobeyed a clear instruction from me. Worse still, an apprentice is aware of this action too. Rather weird how something as innocent as a broken wrist has led to me finding out about this instead.

Will be chatting to the other employee first tomorrow AM to find out what they know and will then chat to him. If he likes his job he will be honest about it and he might keep it. If he lies to me he is out the door because of that.

 

[turnpin]

tell him you have to check with your insurance company and have to do as directed or insurance is void.....regards Turnpin

 

[turnpin]

Look's like you may have different plan's now Croft.....regards Turnpin

 

[mfgs]

Nothing worse than having an employee steal from you. As a small business it feels like a personal theft from yourself. I know a lot of people who steal stuff from companies and they think its fine as its a big business and they wont notice. Its not right either way, but feels worse when you work closely with that individual on a daily basis and they know it directly affects you.

 

[SimonG]

Oh dear. Lies and then sticks on social media. I'd be dropping him down a & e for a cast on his other arm.

Dishonest and stupid = down the road.

 

[newcastle phill]

If hes done that and blew smoke up your backside thats well out of order...
But be cool and ensure your info iis accurate and not embellished by those involved

 

[T & H Plumbing]

Mate he's stolen from you that's grounds for instant dusmisal , i wouldn't let him anywhere near my company again even if he owns up n says sorry what else has he stolen that you don't know about yet?

Once a thief always a their and surely you can't trust him in your customers homes?

 

[REDSAW]

hang on a minute!

you asked him to recycle it? thats what he did or trying to do!!
you are basing your evidence on facebook? does that stand up to a tribunual?

the only thing i can see there is in the future, once bitten......just saying.
you know this but he dosnt know you know...

 

[lame plumber]

BBC if your thinking of dismissing an employee who is off sick, cost someone who tried that on me another £18k on top of their original pay off offer, still they did try binning the HR manager

 

[gassafe]

This is why I work alone... A lot of responsibility employing someone

 

[cr0ft]

I'm investigating it properly not going to be just basing it on Facebook! Not that stupid.

 

[newcastle phill]

Croft - create a facebook page with the dilema....and see how many likes it gets, tag those involved lol.
the public court of opinion lol.

Seriously i hope it works out ok and consider the valid point Redsaw made...
Its possibly not the most honest act - but also not theft by definition.
Possibly tear someone a new one - we all make mistakes and on the odd occasion try and turn a few easy quid if no ones looking (hmrc lol)

 

[Masood]

Mate he's stolen from you that's grounds for instant dusmisal , i wouldn't let him anywhere near my company again even if he owns up n says sorry what else has he stolen that you don't know about yet?

Once a thief always a their and surely you can't trust him in your customers homes?

OK - here's a different viewpoint. He was told to take it to the recycling. In other words, get rid. In his mind, it held no value for cr0ft any longer. It would be no different to picking a bath out of a skip.

Of course, the issue of disobeying a direct instruction remains, but I wouldn't necessarily label him a thief - he may have had quite a different understanding and be aghast at the idea that his actions were being seen as dishonest...

 

[cr0ft]

Cheers guys. Exactly why I popped on here before speaking to him. This place is brill to get other business owner's ideas. I also know that I have a habit of being a hot-head at times so better to speak to others first

 

[plumben]

I think the fact of the way you've found out is making it worse perhaps,
Heres one way of looking at it, he put it in the skip, I come along and then sell it its been disposed of as you said and you've got no control over me removing it from the skip, so what difference is it if he put it in the skip and then removed it

As for the broken wrist, sounds like he wants to work still, i'd either send him off on ssp or get him to do some light office work at home or something along them lines

 

[lame plumber]

if he issigned off, you dont want him near the workplace, my own wrist is in a cast at present, so cant drive - insurance invalid, cant work in other peoples houses - insurance invalid, cant go on the boat, even i have limits
so sat at home thinking about doing some accounts.... been thinking for 7 days now

 

[Kev the gas]

Just a thought but you asked him to get rid at the local dump ?

Trade waste is not allowed as you know, bear that in mind.

 

[Ray Stafford]

OK - here's a different viewpoint. He was told to take it to the recycling. In other words, get rid. In his mind, it held no value for cr0ft any longer. It would be no different to picking a bath out of a skip.

Of course, the issue of disobeying a direct instruction remains, but I wouldn't necessarily label him a thief - he may have had quite a different understanding and be aghast at the idea that his actions were being seen as dishonest...

An interesting one.

A few years ago, we had a similar issue. A department head was responsible for identifying redundant assets in that department, and disposing of them. Traditionally, "disposing" meant "put it in the skip". However, we discovered stuff of our appearing on eBay. It seems that the manager concerned had decided that if it was going in the skip anyway, he may as well sell it on eBay and pocket the proceeds.

But, it was being chucked anyway, so no harm done?

Unfortunately not. After a while, I started to wonder if the decision about writing off the asset became less about its continued value to the organisation, and more about its appeal on eBay.

 

[newcastle phill]

Which is perhaps why such final decisions should have been taken by someone higher up ???