Gas Safety Valve question!

[southcoastboile]

if i were asked to fit a hob i would find this information out before doing so. I had heared of this and think it came up recently when i retook my acs. There is no way any gas engineer can know or even remember every single piece of legislation, i agree i should no but at the same time if you are not sure of something its better to ask, isn't that what this forum is for? i am sure there may even be a thing or to you dont no kirk?

 

[billybob150811]

everyones having their two pence worth i think these threads are real life situations and give interesting insights as to how GSIUR, regs, tb etc are applied much as i respect and value your views i,m resitting my ACS and i just cant bring myself to get out the books i wish you could pm me some will power kirk, big bucket would be nice what i should be doing and what i am doing dont seem to be the same thing

 

[kirkgas]

Not making any excuses for anyone, but there is a serious flaw within the industry, that being there is a major oversight in keeping us updated with the latest regulation changes and TB's.
In my opinion, as soon as you pass your ACS you should submit an email address where any updates are automatically sent and this also should include full access to a database with all the TB's, BS etc. This should be a mater of course.
There would then be no excuse for not keeping upto date and every engineer would have access to the information that ensures we are all working to the latest standards.
I worked as a subie for some time, and the company I had my ticket through were not passing on any TB or Reg updates to it's engineers.

This whole set-up is a shambles.

Graham, you will find there is a legal requirement for the "named responsible person for the gas registered firm" to ensure that all operatives listed to work on gas are kept updated on reg changes, thats why they send a gas mag to every firm, which include all TB;s and changes, they also advise you to keep uptodate on the website, supplying an email address is prob the modern way to do it, but if they did it that way they cannot guarantee you will read it, so they tell you its your responsibility to update you and your guys (if SE then you have 2 roles under the firms GSR) and it soent need to be a gas rengineer who is named most councils and large firms have someone office based whos job it is to deliver the info down the line, i speak to a lot of gas when they come in for asessments and am shocked by the lacadasical attitude their firm seems to have re this, i worked a s agas manager and my role was to deliver what we called tool box talks on gas and H&S and got a signature for everything so that it was the guys responsibility to comply but if the guy doesnt get the training he cannot be held liable, but SE guys are caught in that they must upskill themselves and i know after a hard one day fit the last thing they want to do is log on and check for safety alerts, BUT it is there for them if they want it and we all know what will happen to them if they make a boo boo and are not working to the latest reg, at the moment every gas registered person can access the TB's, safety updates and current version of the IUP by registering to use the GSR website and getting yourself a password, you seem to care and would access it but we both know 100's of engineers who wont go near it after a shift, so to stop them saying "my laptop is broke, ive changed my email address" etc etc then they make it the duty of the responsible person to ensure they are updating their guys and if they dont then thay have someone to blame, and of those who have web access, how often to you check for updates, of those who didnt know you can do it how many will phone on monday and check every night from then on in

 

[kirkgas]

if i were asked to fit a hob i would find this information out before doing so. I had heared of this and think it came up recently when i retook my acs. There is no way any gas engineer can know or even remember every single piece of legislation, i agree i should no but at the same time if you are not sure of something its better to ask, isn't that what this forum is for? i am sure there may even be a thing or to you dont no kirk?

south there is tons i dont know, but i do know that i must be updated on everything or check it out first before i do any work, and cookers requiring FSD's in multi occupancy has been in for years and i still get guys asking about where they can and cant fit cookers, and some dont even know about the FSD's in flats, its shocking that they are so far behind, if employees then its their firms fault, but if SE then im sorry but it has to be their fault, are you an employee or SE
you say you "think" it came up in your recent ACS, im telling you it did wherever you sat it, so you do know, and have created a papertrail which will sink you if you do anything wrong (cause thats why the ACS is written and presented in the way it is) so having recently done ACS reassessment i dont have much sympathy for you saying you dont know everything, as i said nobody knows everything, but having recently passed ACS does it not bother you that you dont know something so basic

 

[kirkgas]

everyones having their two pence worth i think these threads are real life situations and give interesting insights as to how GSIUR, regs, tb etc are applied much as i respect and value your views i,m resitting my ACS and i just cant bring myself to get out the books i wish you could pm me some will power kirk, big bucket would be nice what i should be doing and what i am doing dont seem to be the same thing

you will prob find you are doing yourself a discredit by these comments, i meet lots of guys who do a fine job every day but struggle with the format of the re-assessment, relax, go with your instinct and knowledge and you will be right,

 

[Mike Jackson]

Graham, you will find there is a legal requirement for the "named responsible person for the gas registered firm" to ensure that all operatives listed to work on gas are kept updated on reg changes, thats why they send a gas mag to every firm, which include all TB;s and changes, they also advise you to keep uptodate on the website, supplying an email address is prob the modern way to do it, but if they did it that way they cannot guarantee you will read it, so they tell you its your responsibility to update you and your guys (if SE then you have 2 roles under the firms GSR) and it soent need to be a gas rengineer who is named most councils and large firms have someone office based whos job it is to deliver the info down the line, i speak to a lot of gas when they come in for asessments and am shocked by the lacadasical attitude their firm seems to have re this, i worked a s agas manager and my role was to deliver what we called tool box talks on gas and H&S and got a signature for everything so that it was the guys responsibility to comply but if the guy doesnt get the training he cannot be held liable, but SE guys are caught in that they must upskill themselves and i know after a hard one day fit the last thing they want to do is log on and check for safety alerts, BUT it is there for them if they want it and we all know what will happen to them if they make a boo boo and are not working to the latest reg

In my time with eagaheat I had no access to the gas safe register site and no bulletins etc. of any sort were passed on to me. One that particularly horrified me was SA 006 which highlighted a problem with meter union washers relaxing after they had been tightened leading to a potential for gas escapes.. At no time were we informed of the correct procedure for dealing with this.

 

[kasbek]

Hi again. Quick update, -today i spoke to the Gas fitter who's coming to install my hob and we discussed all the points you chaps raised. He gave me good advice about the regulations and armed with the knowledge I've gained off this forum, and a bit of common sense we both decided my best bet is to 86 the old hob and just cough up for a new one with all the FSD's in place, that can be easily fitted and signed off without any problems with regs.

Nice one! Thanks,

 

[kirkgas]

In my time with eagaheat I had no access to the gas safe register site and no bulletins etc. of any sort were passed on to me. One that particularly horrified me was SA 006 which highlighted a problem with meter union washers relaxing after they had been tightened leading to a potential for gas escapes.. At no time were we informed of the correct procedure for dealing with this.

Mike, this doesnt surprise me at all, the level of incompetance with some of the larger firms is scary

 

[stevetheplumber]

remembering which apliances have tbs refering to them is the hard bit even if you read them all 12 months later when you get a call to service the xyz boiler and the mi's are present are you realy going to remember theres a tb relating to it yes we all got the message regarding vailant heat exchanger seals because their common place its the obscure cooker or hob thats got a tb that will catch us out

 

[Mike Jackson]

I've downloaded all of the bulletins onto my laptop. I'm lucky that once I've read something it sticks in my mind, I may not remember the full thing but normally enough to prompt me to check.

 

[GrahamM]

In my time with eagaheat I had no access to the gas safe register site and no bulletins etc. of any sort were passed on to me. One that particularly horrified me was SA 006 which highlighted a problem with meter union washers relaxing after they had been tightened leading to a potential for gas escapes.. At no time were we informed of the correct procedure for dealing with this.

As per my previous post, the system is majorly flawed. Every one of us should have access to all this information in database and receive the updates direct to personal email. Regardless of being a soul trader, employee or contractor. More pressure should also be put on companies to highlight these updates.
From a point of safety, would this not make sense? I do not believe would be that difficult a system to implement. There should then be no excuse for engineers not being upto date.

 

[kirkgas]

As per my previous post, the system is majorly flawed. Every one of us should have access to all this information in database and receive the updates direct to personal email. Regardless of being a soul trader, employee or contractor. More pressure should also be put on companies to highlight these updates.
From a point of safety, would this not make sense? I do not believe would be that difficult a system to implement. There should then be no excuse for engineers not being upto date.

Graham they are all available to every GSR all they have to do is register for a password and they can read to their hearts content, the problem the problem is if i sent every gas engineer an email now with a safety alert, how can i MAKE them read it, and be liable, if i send it to the registered person for the firm and make it a requirement of registration that they deliver the info out then i have someone to blame and thats why its done the way it is now, the good ones will keep themselves updated the idiots wont that will never change

 

[AWheating]

my old firm had a 400+ workforce, they managed to supply every engineer a folder with all current technical bulletins and regs updates. They also would conduct on site interviews with all engineers to find out areas of weekness and try to implement any training needed to keep standards up.

 

[kirkgas]

my old firm had a 400+ workforce, they managed to supply every engineer a folder with all current technical bulletins and regs updates. They also would conduct on site interviews with all engineers to find out areas of weekness and try to implement any training needed to keep standards up.

sounds like a firm with a robust management system for gas to either A) protect the workforce and customers, or B) protect the MD from being dragged into court when one of the workforce didnt comply, you choose, but either way if the system is in place it helps the engineer keep out the poo