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Discuss Ideal logic 30 combi boiler in the Boilers area at Plumbers Forums
- Status
Just be careful with the logic that either the bypass radiator is correctly sized if your using TRVs all round, or the an auto bypass is fitted. Bit of a negative for fitting them as I can't see the reasoning behind it and there are loads of them about without (read the manual)
Unfortunately though it's a reason to void the 7 year warranty.
Personally, I think I would go for the logic even though I have an ecotec at home! Vaillants have lost a bit of their edge recently and a lot of the features you pay for are above and beyond what the average UK installation can make the most of. Being in warranty for 70% of its predicted lifespan is very valuable, not sure I could justify the additional cost of a Vaillant to my customers.
Stay away from Worcester and you'll be just fine
Unfortunately though it's a reason to void the 7 year warranty.
Personally, I think I would go for the logic even though I have an ecotec at home! Vaillants have lost a bit of their edge recently and a lot of the features you pay for are above and beyond what the average UK installation can make the most of. Being in warranty for 70% of its predicted lifespan is very valuable, not sure I could justify the additional cost of a Vaillant to my customers.
Stay away from Worcester and you'll be just fine
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Red vans?
P
Potty3
What's the difference between the logic and logic plus?
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Different display panel and longer warranty.
L
lame plumber
As above the warranty wont be valid if the system is full of crud when it breaks down, is a magnetic filter included in the price, sludge remover, cleanser and inhibitor, that would be £160 from me alone.
D
Derek Hardman
This is an old thread, the boiler will probably be in the bin now because it wont have been cleaned at that price!
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Love to know the end of this story, anyone care to let us know?
S
sheff paul
If I was fitting one for mother Teresa I would have to charge her more than that
G
gordonv101
If this question is about the Ideal Logic boiler I opted for the Vaillant in the end... Fitted for £1300
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Rickster123
1300 fitted! Good god. I'm glad im not having to compete with these prices anymore.
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Phil_Plumb
it does for a vailliant
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gordonv101
It amazes me the response from some of you gas fitters. If someone else is cheaper than them they are doing it to cheap.... scandalous... OMG... etc etc
This was for a rental property... I have to get the best deal.... I shop around and I haggle. From memory the boiler and bits were £900 ish so the fitter got £400 for a days work. Boiler out boiler in, plus whatever else is involved. The boiler was installed in a cupboard which had to be taken apart for access.
Most people dont earn £150 for a days work let alone £400.
In my book all you are doing is putting yourself to shame and giving away just how much profit you want from fitting a boiler... makes my blood boil let alone the water.
INCIDENTALLY... I live 40 miles away from this particular property and 12 months prior to this boiler I had another Vaillant fitted at my home address. Removal of TWO boilers, one for water and one for heating and new Vaillant installed in place of both... THE COST £1300.
G
gordonv101
It amazes me the response from some of you gas fitters. If someone else is cheaper than them they are doing it to cheap.... scandalous... OMG... etc etc
This was for a rental property... I have to get the best deal.... I shop around and I haggle. From memory the boiler and bits were £900 ish so the fitter got £400 for a days work. Boiler out boiler in, plus whatever else is involved. The boiler was installed in a cupboard which had to be taken apart for access.
Most people dont earn £150 for a days work let alone £400.
In my book all you are doing is putting yourself to shame and giving away just how much profit you want from fitting a boiler... makes my blood boil let alone the water.
INCIDENTALLY... I live 40 miles away from this particular property and 12 months prior to this boiler I had another Vaillant fitted at my home address. Removal of TWO boilers, one for water and one for heating and new Vaillant installed in place of both... THE COST £1300.
This was for a rental property... I have to get the best deal.... I shop around and I haggle. From memory the boiler and bits were £900 ish so the fitter got £400 for a days work. Boiler out boiler in, plus whatever else is involved. The boiler was installed in a cupboard which had to be taken apart for access.
Most people dont earn £150 for a days work let alone £400.
In my book all you are doing is putting yourself to shame and giving away just how much profit you want from fitting a boiler... makes my blood boil let alone the water.
INCIDENTALLY... I live 40 miles away from this particular property and 12 months prior to this boiler I had another Vaillant fitted at my home address. Removal of TWO boilers, one for water and one for heating and new Vaillant installed in place of both... THE COST £1300.
M
Mike Jackson
Unfortunately £400 labour charge for fitting a boiler is not all profit. Are you aware of the expense of running a small business?
You need to look at overheads - public liability insurance, vehicle costs, Gas safe registration, waste transfer licence. What about the cost of my tools, do you expect me to turn up and use a grands worth of combustion analyser out of the goodness of my heart, what about the drill and bits I'm wearing out fitting your boiler? My blow torch costs around £70 and I go through one a year due to the amount of use it gets. Steel toe cap boots at £80 a pair, last about a year.
How about holidays? As a self employed heating engineer when I take a holiday I don't earn any money so I have to make sure that I earn enough the rest of the time to cover the two weeks that I take off.
What about time spent estimating and paperwork? Surely I'm working when doing this so deserve to get paid for it, but no I don't get paid so this time has to be allowed for in my daily/hourly rate.
I get sick and tired of being accused of being money grabbing for wanting to charge a fair rate by someone who works 9-5 5 days a week and has 5 weeks holiday a year. When was the last time you were out at 7 in the morning clearing the back of your van out because you got home too late the night before to clear it out?
You need to look at overheads - public liability insurance, vehicle costs, Gas safe registration, waste transfer licence. What about the cost of my tools, do you expect me to turn up and use a grands worth of combustion analyser out of the goodness of my heart, what about the drill and bits I'm wearing out fitting your boiler? My blow torch costs around £70 and I go through one a year due to the amount of use it gets. Steel toe cap boots at £80 a pair, last about a year.
How about holidays? As a self employed heating engineer when I take a holiday I don't earn any money so I have to make sure that I earn enough the rest of the time to cover the two weeks that I take off.
What about time spent estimating and paperwork? Surely I'm working when doing this so deserve to get paid for it, but no I don't get paid so this time has to be allowed for in my daily/hourly rate.
I get sick and tired of being accused of being money grabbing for wanting to charge a fair rate by someone who works 9-5 5 days a week and has 5 weeks holiday a year. When was the last time you were out at 7 in the morning clearing the back of your van out because you got home too late the night before to clear it out?
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gordonv101
Your rantings dont wash with me... I have been self employed for 31 years so I know all about the costs of running a business. The first 6 years of being self employed I used to work seven days a week and loved every minute of it.
In my dealings with different tradesman with my properties they will gladly work for £100 to 160 a day depending on the trade and that is paid by cheque.
What about a car mechanic... He has to have a grands worth of tools which he has to buy himself and anybody similar who need boots has to buy there own. He Doesnt charge anybody else for them. He pays for them out of his salary which if pushed might be £100 a day.
On Friday I will be out at 6.30 am to drive a round trip of 250 miles in a car paid for by myself and likewise fuel in the tank.
Your only argument that I agree with is the holidays but I have been in that boat for 31 years so that dont wash with me either.
In my dealings with different tradesman with my properties they will gladly work for £100 to 160 a day depending on the trade and that is paid by cheque.
What about a car mechanic... He has to have a grands worth of tools which he has to buy himself and anybody similar who need boots has to buy there own. He Doesnt charge anybody else for them. He pays for them out of his salary which if pushed might be £100 a day.
On Friday I will be out at 6.30 am to drive a round trip of 250 miles in a car paid for by myself and likewise fuel in the tank.
Your only argument that I agree with is the holidays but I have been in that boat for 31 years so that dont wash with me either.
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You have well and truly rattled Mikes cage there, I tend to agree with Mike though, the £400 'earnings' will have materials coming out of that, unless the installer has his own copper mine.
magnetic filters, waste pipe, earth bonding strips, glue, flux, solder, screws, clips, cement, gas, plus all the business overheads mentioned would at least half them 'earnings' if not more.
If I was a landlord myself, I would tend to want to keep expenses low so I could make a profit, but being 31 years self employed I would have thought you would have known better with regard to somebody charging what thier skills are worth. A mechanic of any decent standard is worth more than 100 a day, that's obvious.
For the training plumbers and heating engineers have to do, the work they put in, the things they have to carry, if you think 100 a day is ok I think you are living in fantasy land.
magnetic filters, waste pipe, earth bonding strips, glue, flux, solder, screws, clips, cement, gas, plus all the business overheads mentioned would at least half them 'earnings' if not more.
If I was a landlord myself, I would tend to want to keep expenses low so I could make a profit, but being 31 years self employed I would have thought you would have known better with regard to somebody charging what thier skills are worth. A mechanic of any decent standard is worth more than 100 a day, that's obvious.
For the training plumbers and heating engineers have to do, the work they put in, the things they have to carry, if you think 100 a day is ok I think you are living in fantasy land.
£100 a day for this job SE??? Are you drunk?
i could get £120/£130 a day on the cards if I wanted, why would I like all the extra hassle that being SE brings for less than I could get working for someone else.
Even at your more realist £160 a day you're still pushing it.
I know what I'm worth, I know what I can get and I'm happy with what I earn.
I would however cry myself to sleep at night if I was earning £100 a day
R
Rickster123
I bet you a fiver this boiler isn't to regs
I bet you a tenner it isn't flushed, benchmark is left empty, no inhibitor added the list goes on! But it was a bargain!
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£1300 was a steal... I would have fitted one for this when I was more naive. But if your engineer is giving everybody this kind of rate, he won't be earning any kind of living.... Must be desperate and just 'getting by'. The cost of being a self employed engineer are truly horrific if you do everything by the book
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