Is my charge reasonable?

[Harvest Fields]

You cannot work on any gas appliance unless you are gas safe registered. This is and always has been the case. (Since we have had a regulating body)

 

[fixitflav]

You cannot work on any gas appliance unless you are gas safe registered. This is and always has been the case. (Since we have had a regulating body)

But ShaunCorbs said
"He won’t gas safe can only come in when someone charges for gas work and there not reg
If they do it for free gas safe don’t care"

I don't understand, please explain.

 

[Harvest Fields]

Better off asking him and not me. I may have misread it. @ShaunCorbs

 

[ShaunCorbs]

Better off asking him and not me. I may have misread it. @ShaunCorbs

Yes ?

 

[Harvest Fields]

Yes ?

But ShaunCorbs said
"He won’t gas safe can only come in when someone charges for gas work and there not reg
If they do it for free gas safe don’t care"

I don't understand, please explain.

 

[Rob Foster]

So presumably you can work on on your own boiler (as long as you don't pay yourself ) and that's OK? We're often told otherwise on this and other forums.

Anybody whom carries out work to a gas appliance needs to be experienced and trained.
If it is for gain then they must be GSR, however if a numpty plays with their own device then they immediately invalidate their home insurance and leave themselves open to criminal proceedings by others. If you all want when my barrister wakes up I will find out from her how long the tariff for this offence might be
Rob Foster ...aka centralheatking

 

[Harvest Fields]

Anybody whom carries out work to a gas appliance needs to be experienced and trained.
If it is for gain then they must be GSR, however if a numpty plays with their own device then they immediately invalidate their home insurance and leave themselves open to criminal proceedings by others. If you all want when my barrister wakes up I will find out from her how long the tariff for this offence might be
Rob Foster ...aka centralheatking

I hope she charges you by the hour.

 

[Ric2013]

if a numpty plays with their own device then they immediately invalidate their home insurance and leave themselves open to criminal proceedings by others

If I play with my device and don't cause any damage to others, what are the legal procedings going to be for, and who will be pressing for them?

 

[fixitflav]

If I play with my device and don't cause any damage to others, what are the legal procedings going to be for, and who will be pressing for them?

Good question, and what if a sensible, experienced DIY-er works on their own device?

 

[Harvest Fields]

I’m now lost? What are we talking about here?

 

[Rob Foster]

I hope she charges you by the hour.

I got a life sentance in fact if I had gassed her on day one I would be well out by now.

 

[fixitflav]

I’m now lost? What are we talking about here?

Whether a non-GSR person can (legally) work on their own boiler.

 

[Harvest Fields]

Ohhh. I’m with it again now then.

 

[Rob Foster]

1998 Gas Regulations cover most of the above. The largest fine a quick trawl uncovered was £1.2m plus sundry other fines and costs. 18 months in clink seems to be average incarceration. Plus the danger diy gas work puts the home owners family in. Its not just gas bangs but flue gas. solid fuel carries other dangers.
Rob Foster aka centralheatking

 

[Murdoch]

Whether a non-GSR person can (legally) work on their own boiler.

Why would a non GSR person work on a boiler?

Anyone with even half a brain knows that they are blxxdy dangerous ..... and can explode

 

[Ric2013]

Why would a non GSR person work on a boiler?

Anyone with even half a brain knows that they are blxxdy dangerous ... and can explode

Because every year I have to straighten the fixing lugs on the decorative casing on the boiler at my mother's house after some numpty who happens to be a RGI bends them by removing the casing in a ham-fisted manner (next year I will supervise).

Because I had three RGIs look at my own boiler unable to work out why it was overheating 'perhaps it's supposed to do that'. Then I discovered the flow and return had been reversed.

Because I've watched (yet another) RGI work on my boiler, fit the functional casing and then wonder why the boiler wouldn't fire, then he realised he'd left one corner hanging off and had missed the fixing hook entirely. Lucky the boiler has pressure sensors able to recognise that the casing has been put on by an idiot. (The manufacturer's instructions say to check the condition of the seal and to check the casing has been fitted correctly. Ha ha.)

The one that said a heating system was full of air and it turned out he hadn't checked the ballcock on an open-vented system.

The one who serviced a boiler he had originally fitted for a customer of mine and then ignored her all weekend when she told him, in the middle of winter, that her heating wasn't working. He was eager enough to come and look when she sent a text saying 'don't worry - I'll call Baxi out'. Customer is in her 60s and has emphysema, but by then I was on my way (it was his shoddy wiring).

This, sadly, is the level of competence I find in local gas installers. People ask me for recommendations and I'm currently unable to give any. You can understand why I would feel safer in my own house if I had worked on my own boiler than allowed an unknown person with a Gas Safe card to work on it for me. So, yes, it would be interesting to see what the law says.

 

[Harvest Fields]

We are not all like that mate and people still shouldn’t mess with gas unless trained.

 

[Ric2013]

We are not all like that mate and people still shouldn’t mess with gas unless trained.

I know we aren't all like that, but you can well understand why the industry has such an awful reputation. I note that my thread in the Gas Installer required forum has received zero interest, so I can only assume all the good ones did the sensible thing and ran as far from Colchester as they could.

One guy I used to use and who had seemed quite good got struck off the register. I did know another guy who also seemed quite good, not that I actually met him myself (though he was at least reassuringly expensive), but he did make me wait a month for a repeat annual boiler service before finally telling me he simply wouldn't have the time (as he no longer does domestic).

Another guy I've heard of installed a boiler but hadn't had it it setting mode when he set it up, so it wasn't correctly commissioned. Luckily the manufacturer sorted this out and commented 'it happens often'.

So, just personally, I've been through 5 gas installers and found, perhaps, only one good one. Let's hope I'm just unlucky because, so far, 80% of the local ones are not very good. If I based solely on my own experience, I'd have to draw the conclusion that whatever training people do for their membership of Corgi and now Gas Safe does not give (or is not enough to give) a competent person.

You will well understand that, in my own home, with my relatively simple Potterton Profile, I would be more inclined to trust myself than a random technician/installer from the Yellow Pages when it came to the fan, pressure sensors (they only register a pressure or lack of: no proportionality involved), theromocouples, thermostats, solonoids, and the pcb, though I wouldn't be happy setting up a gas valve.

Quite honestly, I do know someone I would trust with it, but he hasn't been Gas Safe or Corgi since the 80s, so he wouldn't be allowed to touch it either! Obviously one of you horrible lot would be welcome.

In the meantime, I just don't have it serviced and keep it under observation. If I suddenly disappear, you'll know why.

 

[Jerry]

All those parts are fitted dry (no wet work). Can't take more than 1 hour each to change a fan and pcb.

That's 2 out of the 10 hours. 8 hours to diagnose ?

£45/hr is cheap for my area.

A failed fan pressure switch is an easy test and hard to get wrong.

Pretty sure if you had called the technical helpdesk of the manufacturer and they had walked you through the process and found the fault with you, it would have taken less than 10 hours.

 

[Jim09876]

40 hours @£45 per hour comes to £1800.

 

[Jim09876]

Oh yeh i see, not charging nowhere near enough then.

 

[markadams]

Cost is way over the top in my opinion, I cant see how it would take 4 visits and 10 hours to diagnose a fan or pressure switch fault.

I wouldnt have the nerve to ask for that amount.

What were the symptoms of the fault.

 

[Lee Davies]

Cost is way over the top in my opinion, I cant see how it would take 4 visits and 10 hours to diagnose a fan or pressure switch fault.

I wouldnt have the nerve to ask for that amount.

What were the symptoms of the fault.

I know, that's the point I was getting at. More incompetence than working hours.

I would expect a fan and pressure switch to be a charge of 4 hours plus parts and mark-up.

That would allow for 1 visit to diagnose.
Part supply.
1 visit to to repair.

But again it depends how your pricing is structured.
I know engineers that charge a minimum of 2 hours (this helps cover travel costs) and engineers who charge a call-out fee which covers the first hour plus half an hour to travel there.

 

[markadams]

I seem to be charging about £100 labour for this type of job.

 

[Harvest Fields]

I seem to be charging about £100 labour for this type of job.

Most of the time mate, price depends on location.