I've settled on an Intergas boiler.

[Stan]

I have posted a few times, mainly regarding my indecision to go for either an Ideal or an Intergas open vent boiler.

Having taken note of comments here and having, today, visited [with my installer] a local Plumbase shop to see the area Representative/Contracts Manager displaying an Xclusive combi boiler I (we) have pretty much decided to go for a 30kw Xclusive Combi. The bigger (36kw) is a bit too tall to fit the space).

Initially, and by way of a sort of compromise, I will probably have it fitted as an OPEN VENT boiler which fulfills my desire for retaining an unpressurised system and in keeping the F & E in place - and will upgrade to a full combi heating system at a later stage - i.e. if the hot water cylinder starts to leak or something else forces my hand.

The feeds to the boiler are currently from above and I'm told there isn't a stand off frame currently available and in order to run the pipes behind the boiler the rep. suggested standing the boiler off the wall using two lengths of 2" x 2" and a board made from something like 18mm ply. Both the rep. and the guy in technical confirm there's no need for a heat resistant backboard.

I have a 22mm gas supply to the boiler. I'll fit a Magnaclean Pro 2 and will have the system flushed. I'll change the present manual bypass (in the cylinder cupboard) for an automatic one. I have already run a 3 plus earth cable from the cylinder to the boiler.

What, I wonder, have I missed?

Thanks to all who advised previously and led me towards the Intergas option.

 

[Aire]

Don't believe it will work as an open vent. Instructions say below 0.5bar, you will get a low pressure warning and the heating will function at a reduced capacity. 0.2bar and below and the heating won't function.

Also, why keep the cylinder when fitting a combi?

 

[Stan]

Ah - there you have me. I am only going by what the Southern Area Contracts Manager tells us when he demonstrated the boiler today.. And the fact that all their advertising blurb says you can run them as open vent. Obviously I can't speak from any position of authority myself. I will need to be satisfied that either he's right or you're right.

The idea of keeping the cylinder relates to the fact that originally I was determined to replace the old open vent Ideal boiler on a 'one for one' basis - keeping it simple by retaining the F and E and seperate Grundfos pump and the three way valve etc.

Then it seemed that I could keep my options open by just fitting the Xclusive combi and keeping the open vent system and being able to convert to full combi operation at a later stage if need be. That way I get my wish to keep an open vent system in the short term but can conform to everyone elses recommedation to have a combi - at some later date.

Many thanks for the quick and very pertinent reply!

 

[Aire]

You can have it as an open vent so long as you can maintain 0.5bar pressure. Not knowing the distance between the base of your header tank and the top of your boiler, I can't say whether the required pressure can met.

 

[Stan]

Give me five minutes and I'll measure it.

Ta.

 

[Stan]

Base of the F & E to top of the boiler = 12 feet or 3.6 metres.

 

[Aire]

That will give you approx 0.36 bar of pressure. If you can raise the tank a further 1.4 metres that should give you enough pressure for the boiler to function correctly.

 

[Stan]

Mmmm. Do I want to go to that trouble?

Food for thought.

Grateful for the advice though.

I haven't committed to anything as we speak.

 

[Aire]

That's completely up to you. Is there a reason your wanting to keep your system as an open vent? Is there a real risk of pipes bursting etc or is it just a fear you have?

 

[Stan]

The latter. It's a 23 year old 10mm microbore system with the ground floor fed from drops in the first floor void and the manifold is under 8 x 4 sheets of tongue and groove chip which is under tidy carpet etc, I dread the thought of a leak caused by me pressurising the system when I could have left it as it was. However - everyone tells me not to worry.

 

[Riley]

I really think you are worrying about nothing

 

[Stan]

Yes, you could be right ... you're probably getting to know I'm cautious and guilty of over thinking though.

 

[Riley]

Not to sound harsh. Maybe stop and listen to what pros are telling you

 

[Aire]

The latter. It's a 23 year old 10mm microbore system with the ground floor fed from drops in the first floor void and the manifold is under 8 x 4 sheets of tongue and groove chip which is under tidy carpet etc, I dread the thought of a leak caused by me pressurising the system when I could have left it as it was. However - everyone tells me not to worry.

It is a risk that I tell all my customers when upgrading systems. However I have only had it twice where the increased pressure caused any issues. One was corroded copper and the other was burst radiators so your risk is minimum.

 

[AMGasServices]

On the intergas you can set it up to disable the low water pressure sensor.

 

[Stan]

Maybe stop and listen to what pros are telling you -

All received.

The trouble is the pros have told me all sorts.
1. Fit the one with longest warranty
2. The warranty will be worthless coz they'll wriggle out of it.
3. Fit an Ideal.
4. Fit an Intergas.
5. Fit a Worcester or a Vaillant.
6. A replacement Heat Only open vent will be the easiest and cheapest option, so do that.
7. A sealed systyem is the way to go.

I admit the majority say sealed rather than open.

 

[Stan]

On the intergas you can set it up to disable the low water pressure sensor.

Aha - another avenue to explore??

 

[Riley]

I don’t know why you’re dead set on Intergas where they’ve had issue with warranty parts ie obtaining them.

Start again:
What do you want to achieve for your money?
You have to understand we can only lead you so far. You have to make the final decision yourself. How many quotes have you actually had??

 

[Stan]

I had one local company quote a year or so ago - they offered a number of options but favoured Worcester at the time. They told me to consider an unvented cylinder and system boiler and spoke about other upgrades to the programmer etc.

No other quotes because, as mentioned elsewhere, I have a long standing mate who has fitted Glowworm, Baxi and Ideal - and who doesn't rate WB or Vaillant and has only recently become interested in Intergas.

I honestly am spending time looking at options - the existing Ideal Classic FanFare 250 is OK but I realise it could fail (expensively) and I think I ought to be ready (in case it does fail overnight )

If it's considered that I'm taking the time of forum contributors unnecessarily then I need to be told - but till then I'm learning and hoping to do the right thing.

 

[Riley]

We are happy to help but it does seem that whatever we say to you, you keep coming back to Intergas. I know there are some guys on here that rate them but in my eyes they are a bit of a gimmick and a bit of an unknown quantity in terms of longevity. I’d be far more inclined to go with a Vaillant or a Glowworm as on the rare occasions I’ve had to use them the aftersales service has been second to none. Further down the line you will also not struggle to get parts. The amount of ball ache you have had just trying to sort that stand off and flueing issue would have been sorted in two minutes flat with one of the above named. Just my opinion but perhaps don’t use your mate. He has his opinion it doesn’t have to be yours

 

[Stan]

Again I say "all received" and further grateful thanks. He has fitted Glowworm (he put a combi in my neighbour opposite's place). He tends to reckon WB are a tad overrated and not that simple to work on. But, as has been said, every installer has his favourites for whatever reason - be that cashback or freebies or just that they find one manufacturer to be better at backup or more reliable???



I hear your thoughts re IG and would just say that I do feel so confused when so many contributors have such conflicting experiences with ALL of the usual names - but the feedback I seem to see about IG seems pretty universally positive. BUT, comments on the forums don't tell the whole story, as we all know.

All food for thought though - and I remain grateful.

 

[Riley]

Were it me I’d get three quotes from different companies. See what they suggest and ask them why. I bet none of them suggest IG. Worcester are overrated because their boilers are not the quality build they once were and their service dept is now dire

 

[Stan]

Sound advice. ta.

 

[John.g]

I have posted a few times, mainly regarding my indecision to go for either an Ideal or an Intergas open vent boiler.

Having taken note of comments here and having, today, visited [with my installer] a local Plumbase shop to see the area Representative/Contracts Manager displaying an Xclusive combi boiler I (we) have pretty much decided to go for a 30kw Xclusive Combi. The bigger (36kw) is a bit too tall to fit the space).

Initially, and by way of a sort of compromise, I will probably have it fitted as an OPEN VENT boiler which fulfills my desire for retaining an unpressurised system and in keeping the F & E in place - and will upgrade to a full combi heating system at a later stage - i.e. if the hot water cylinder starts to leak or something else forces my hand.

The feeds to the boiler are currently from above and I'm told there isn't a stand off frame currently available and in order to run the pipes behind the boiler the rep. suggested standing the boiler off the wall using two lengths of 2" x 2" and a board made from something like 18mm ply. Both the rep. and the guy in technical confirm there's no need for a heat resistant backboard.

I have a 22mm gas supply to the boiler. I'll fit a Magnaclean Pro 2 and will have the system flushed. I'll change the present manual bypass (in the cylinder cupboard) for an automatic one. I have already run a 3 plus earth cable from the cylinder to the boiler.

What, I wonder, have I missed?

Thanks to all who advised previously and led me towards the Intergas option.

Just in case you have missed this, the CH output of the Xclusive 30 is (100%) factory adjusted to 19.4 kw output, probably no big deal except that you are heating large amounts of hot water at the same time.
https://www.freeboilermanuals.com/assets/pdf/intergas/xclusive.pdf

 

[Riley]

Kind of irrelevant though if he’s contrmplating changing his mind