New Boiler installation

[newcastle phill]

No it goes down to about 7kw min

 

[Ermintrude]

Nope duo He and plat HE as as follows

24kw to 7.4
28kw to 9.5
33kw to 10.2
40kw to 12.1

Now the best modulation is on an icoz. It will go from 35kw all the way down to 1.1kw
Unfortunately it flashes LF a lot an has a black pcb........

The vogue is 14:1

 

[hammers4spanner]

yes was wrong its the other that modulates right down,

it also modulates right down to zero as it never flaming works

 

[Nostrum]

Vogue is 7:1

icos is 4:1 at best.

you see some (greenstar junior for example) seem to basically de rate a 28kw to make a 24, so not even 4:1.

I think vokera do a 10:1 but, well, it's a vokera.

 

[sp25]

They're definately not fobbing you off, in fact they're probably more likely doing you a favour by taking a broken heavy old boiler away for you. You don't wanna get lumbered with it, your local dump might not accept it either as it's obviously not waste created by diy lol. Part of the reason you see boilers left out the front of houses for travellers to pick up,or left in peoples back gardens for years

Thanks for clarifying. I am convinced to let them have it if so be the case. I have heard of boiler installation companies who come to repair your boiler and ask for it to be replaced saying there is a major fault with it. Then remove it and sell it off in second hand market after fixing any minor issues if it was present in the first place...;-) Hence was a bit paranoid about the idea of letting the installation company walk away with an old boiler..b'cos like most optimistic people i like to think that my boiler can be repaired and can go on for few more years if only a good gas engineer can look at it.

It's probably best we replace ours anyway as it should be atleast over 14 years old and also not very energy efficient as the new models.

 

[sp25]

Dear experts,
another problem has just arose..

as Baxi platinum HEA is a bigger model than the Glowworm 80e (dimensions unknown-not obvious from manual or anywhere online!) and also as Baxi requires 22mm pipes unlike Glowworm 80e(couldn't find any info related to this), the installer has mentioned that the installation will affect the kitchen units and they cannot guarantee it'll be saved due to the age of the units.

I wonder if you know of any Baxi models that can fit in the same dimensions pipe as Glowworm 80e? I could ask the installer what our current pipe dimensions are but cannot ring him till Monday as I don't find it fair to disturb him on the weekend when he's not at work..

My preference would be to stick to Baxi model as their CS seems good. However, if we cannot then we have to go with a Vaillant (2nd option) or Glow-worm (3rd) or consider a different brand from your expert opinions..

Thanks for mentioning about Ideal Vogue..it seems 10 year guarantee too...Is there any other reliable ones with a longer guarantee that you could recommend if there is no workable solution to the above.

thanks for your time

 

[sp25]

Vogue is 7:1

icos is 4:1 at best.

you see some (greenstar junior for example) seem to basically de rate a 28kw to make a 24, so not even 4:1.

I think vokera do a 10:1 but, well, it's a vokera.

Dear all,
Can you pls clarify what this modulation thingy is and what does the best mean in terms of modulation numbers.

Which ratio is better?

Pls explain in lay man terms as im not an expert...just a common man

thanks,

 

[sp25]

Ideal Vogue every time.

Similar to a Vaillant in design but better value. More economical then any of the above. 10 year warranty and it looks pretty.

Bigger isn't always better, especially for combi's. The difference between a 28kw and a 24kw as far as hot water is concerned is about 2 mins longer to run a full (100 litre) bath, assuming you add no cold. The difference is the bigger the boiler the less chance you have of reducing short cycling on heating.

Hot water = approx 30% of your fuel bill
Heating = approx 70%

So the savings are in the heating and the way the system is designed, not how fast you can run a hot tap.

For a few extra quid you could add weather compensation and further increase the efficiency.

thanks Nostrum, just a quick clarification regarding your suggestion.
could u pls clarify whether bigger is better if i go for Baxi platinum 28. GSR said that 24 should be sufficient for a flat size (2BR+1bath+2sinks+6radiators (double)). We don't generally use the bath, 99.9% only shower (powered by the boiler). I don't mind waiting for the hot water flow to start a few seconds later and generally the first minute or so its cold water anyway..,and the water is not metered ;-)..
Please clarify whether bigger is better in the above scenario? and if not why not pls?

im happy to invest in 33 if required (if its better efficiency in terms of heating). Thanks for the % proportion..wasn't sure how much of gas for each generally.

thanks,

 

[Ermintrude]

Ideal logic plus. Perfect size gas inlet 15mm. ( needs to be able to supply correct rate of gas) so if it's longer than 2m in 15mm u may have problems!!!!

 

[dmheat]

It's likely that whatever boiler you choose the gas pipe will need upgraded, 99% of old combis (yours being 14years old) will be on significantly undersized gas supplies.

Don't worry too much about modulation ratios,they're mainly a sales pitch. Basically a boiler with a lower ratio won't modulate as low, so as the temp rises the boiler stat will shut it off and continue to pump round. A boiler that modulates low will continue to heat at a low gas rate in order to maintain a smooth flow temp. One goes off...other burns at a lower rate for longer. Unless you are talking about large properties here the real world effect is firstly minimal, and secondly will not translate into any kind of saving...they are arguments for parts longevity etc too...personally I think when it comes to domestic boilers it's a sale ploy...

Size your combi for desired hot water flow rate....if you're getting 15lpm+ and decent pressure but fit a 24kw boiler, when you open a tap fully you will not get a satisfactory temp rise...2mins extra to run a bath is a poor example...good pressure shower with enough hot water VS good pressure shower with luke warm water is a better example.

Your installer needs to measure dynamic water pressure,standing pressure and flow rate to give you a good idea of what boiler size you need/would benefit from. Otherwise you might have to throttle down your decent flow rate, to a crap flow rate, just to get the water hot enough.

Fit a logic plus

 

[sp25]

Ideal logic plus. Perfect size gas inlet 15mm. ( needs to be able to supply correct rate of gas) so if it's longer than 2m in 15mm u may have problems!!!!

Thanks Ermintrude, I estimate that the gas meter to the boiler distance is approx about 7-8 metres. Also, as others said, probably gas pipes need upgrading upon a new boiler installation!

Love the ideal warranty and recommendations..

 

[sp25]

thanks dmheat! yes, probably the pipes need replacing upon new installation.

GSR didn't do the formalities as testing water pressure etc., he seems experienced and they are a reliable local company from what i know.

Starting to get IDEAL into my head now! Although the below has brought me back to square one of my search for a reliable boiler!

And may be wasted a £1 on which trial on boiler reviews and more confused than ever before. The topmost recommended brands are Worcester. Statistically they seem to be the highest ranking with Worcester brand ONLY in their best buys table.

Quoted from Which boiler review as below.
"Average customer score=80% based on responses from 4354 condensing gas boiler owners who have bought a boiler since April 2006.
Responses for each brand are: Alpha(87), Baxi (267), BG(178), GW(327), Ideal(195), Johnson&Starley(31), Main (45), Potterton (172), Rehema Avanta (32), Vaillant (847), Viessman(130), Vokera(55), Worcester(1844)"

If 1844 Worcester have consistently ranked their boiler to be good that must be something?! Or perhaps this is very biased as the number of responses are significantly larger for this brand. Also, avg score for this brand is 89% that includes whether they would recommend this boiler to others.

In addition, i am surprised that none here has recommended Worcester. Any reasons? Kindly share pls.

i dont want to annoy my GSR by saying i want another quote for Worcester as he may think i am fooling around. However, i genuinely want to see what the price difference would be. Not impressed with their 5 year guarantee though....if its the best of the best as recommended by Which, why are they not giving a longer guarantee?

 

[dmheat]

That's a pathetically inaccurate survey and NO indication of boiler quality or reliability lol

 

[sp25]

That's a pathetically inaccurate survey and NO indication of boiler quality or reliability lol

lol, that's true

as it's based on boiler owner's review and if 1000+ have installed it and liked it, wouldn't it be a factor that you take into account?

wish there was a verified purchase/review for boilers

 

[Ermintrude]

It's because Worcester actively chances feedback and there though nah!

 

[squidlips]

we have an ideal logic combi in our fishing club house,it runs the hot water for a flat and the bar area,it also heats the flat and bar.
never missed a beat in the 3yrs it has been fitted and the bar is open an average 70 hrs a week

 

[sp25]

It's because Worcester actively chances feedback and there though nah!

Thanks, yes it seems quite obvious given the big difference in uptake of the survey!

Wondered what the GSR's on this forum think about Worcester brand from your personal experiences of installing/follow on compliants...this may probably a less biased opinion than a single brand promoted survey.

Worcester - good/bad - personal/professional experiences?

 

[dmheat]

Reputation built on tv adverts, BG installing them, and they treat their platinum and diamond installers (companies that install X amount per year) very well, days out, power tools, etc etc

In the real world, plastic components and rubbish to work on. Not designed for maintenance....at all.

Their after sales is excellent however but warrantys aren't that long compared to others.

If you need a cupboard fit combi your choices are limited, my personal and professional recommendation would be an ideal logic+ or a baxi avanta but others may or may not agree. It's like asking a mechanic for a car recommendation, you'll rarely hear the same car twice lol

 

[jtsplumbing]

Ok lets upset the apple cart ! she likes Baxi, but concerned over boiler size, Think about the New Baxi Blue range more compact in size, not yet fitted one but looks good boiler with some very good extra fetcher's

 

[dmheat]

I'd only fit the ecoblue advance, the ecoblue+ is the compact version with composite hydroblocks (as you might be able to tell,they're a pet hate of mine lol)

 

[Ermintrude]

No no no no don't. Only Baxi you should ever consider is the HE duotec platinum range the rest are utter shister. Baxi know this and that's why even though they have launched 7 new boilers, rebranded remeha main they still selling HE boiler. When it's withdrawn we will not be fitting Baxi. We fit literally 100's a year.

 

[julesverne]

Erms will you be fitting the logic when it goes all plastic it seems their all manufacturers are going this way

 

[Ermintrude]

Yep logics again. They are same as Baxi HE in my mind. Plus side is the washing of hex and installer mode. Downside pressure gauge / location tick. Flue quality : cost . And the fact after installing a zillion still forget vertical flue adaptor when it's a vertical then horiz flue termination

 

[LPC]

Christ it's only a boiler. All the top brands are pretty good and installation matters more anyway.

Pick one, get it installed properly by a man that can speak properly; do something more interesting.

 

[sp25]

Yep logics again. They are same as Baxi HE in my mind. Plus side is the washing of hex and installer mode. Downside pressure gauge / location tick. Flue quality : cost . And the fact after installing a zillion still forget vertical flue adaptor when it's a vertical then horiz flue termination

Thanks all!
Sticking to Baxi platinum..if it cannot be fit without disturbing kitchen units too much, then it'll be another Baxi-poss Duo tech! If not, will consider Ideal as it offers same warranty and seems to have received some good comments here..

thanks for your input much appreciated..