So fed up with ignorant customers

[helpsy]

Get a card machine!

 

[woodsy]

More and more tradespeople are taking £50 deposit around where I live.

Crikey, struggle to get £50 when I've done the job, never mind before it.

 

[Wet dream]

Yeah I imagine it would do more harm than good, the genuine custards don't wanna pay before hand? Plus no would it work anyway? Knock on the door and ask for a tenner for my part payment?

That said my friend is all ways busy. And in 18 years he has only lost £800 in bad debts where as I have lost in excess of 18k. He takes deposit and full payment before leaving property. I just don't see to have the balls to do it for some reason. As you may tell it is something we have been talking about lately

 

[Wet dream]

Crikey, struggle to get £50 when I've done the job, never mind before it.

You need a min charge and confirm this before going to job if your serious

 

[lame plumber]

had the normal one today, oil boiler needs a service, next thursday at 0900 says I, oh,can you come at 4.30 as we are both teachers, when was it last serviced says I? on bout 3 or 4 years ago says she. My little cell in the head whirrs for a bit, 4.30 and no service for years will mean late home that day, so NO thanks. do you work weekends says she, do you says I of course not says she, you all know my reply

my question about 3 weeks holiday and planning ahead failed to enlist a response bar a click of the phone dropping, seems I didnt need that sort of customer this year

 

[Mike Jackson]

agree totally

just went to a customers house at an agreed time she let me in and theres already a plumber upstairs quoting her for the work

he looked at me and said "giz a min will ya" so i stormed out.
can understand customers getting quotes from elsewhere but booking the tradesmen to come all at same time?

I had something similar. I turned up to look at a job and was wandering up and down the street looking for the place. I noticed another guy wandering about aimlessly as well. Turns out he was looking for the place as well. We teamed up and found the place. I was flat out at the time and the other guy was going through a quiet patch so I told him what price I would be quoting so that he could go lower if he wanted. No point falling out with other plumbers over things like this I've possibly got a few jobs to do for him because he's got some customers that want LPG boilers put in and he's only got NG.

 

[mfgs]

had the normal one today, oil boiler needs a service, next thursday at 0900 says I, oh,can you come at 4.30 as we are both teachers, when was it last serviced says I? on bout 3 or 4 years ago says she. My little cell in the head whirrs for a bit, 4.30 and no service for years will mean late home that day, so NO thanks. do you work weekends says she, do you says I of course not says she, you all know my reply

my question about 3 weeks holiday and planning ahead failed to enlist a response bar a click of the phone dropping, seems I didnt need that sort of customer this year

I can see the frustration of the times being awkward, but as a one man band or small business, flexibility can get you jobs off the big companies who only work 9-5. I regularly book in evening appointments etc and as such have very loyal customers. If you are busy enough to be able to turn work away and pick and choose jobs that's fine and good luck to you, but for people starting out this attitude wont get you very far.

 

[SimonG]

I can see the frustration of the times being awkward, but as a one man band or small business, flexibility can get you jobs off the big companies who only work 9-5. I regularly book in evening appointments etc and as such have very loyal customers. If you are busy enough to be able to turn work away and pick and choose jobs that's fine and good luck to you, but for people starting out this attitude wont get you very far.

Ah but theres flexibility and people extracting the urine. If its truly a service then no hurry but through tbe day at a convenient time to both. I would do a service on a saturday morning. A breakdown is on my terms. If somebody cant be available on my schedule to have heating and hot water then they can stay cold and dirty.

But it does depend on your own position. Starting out or not a lot on then you will be flexible. Works steady and you like your family, then all bets are off.

I like the fact that I'm busy, have a good customer base and I am comfortable saying no. Saying no takes a lot of getting to.

 

[Best]

Sometimes doing an emergency job at after hours, weekends or, say Christmas eve, can win you friends as the customer (especially if they were a stranger) will often tell everyone they can about how you helped them.
Trouble is you are only brilliant in people's eyes until you fail to jump to their next demand some day & then many will not want to know you.

 

[Ray Stafford]

Sometimes doing an emergency job at after hours, weekends or, say Christmas eve, can win you friends as the customer (especially if they were a stranger) will often tell everyone they can about how you helped them.
Trouble is you are only brilliant in people's eyes until you fail to jump to their next demand some day & then many will not want to know you.

But isn't that what being in a service industry is all about? You are as good as your customers last experience of you.

An old mentor of mine used to say "There is no such thing as a customer list. What you have is a list of people who used you last month. You have to win their business again tomorrow, next week and next month. Never assume that they are your customer - the moment that you do, you are half way to losing them."

 

[MarieHigham]

Yep I've had this before five of us at the same time I did wonder what was going on with all the vans in the street custard said right your all here now who will give me the best price, I went straight for the door but more alarming is that not everyone did.

I don't see why it is "alarming" that not everyone followed you through the door?!

If you're hungry, you're hungry and will quote for the work. I don't see it being rude, at the end of the day when visiting a customer or potential customer you're there to give a quote it is essentially tendering for work. What is the difference between giving a quote infront of other customers and tendering for work online?

 

[jonnyswamp]

I don't see why it is "alarming" that not everyone followed you through the door?!

If you're hungry, you're hungry and will quote for the work. I don't see it being rude, at the end of the day when visiting a customer or potential customer you're there to give a quote it is essentially tendering for work. What is the difference between giving a quote infront of other customers and tendering for work online?

What would you think of an estate agent who, after accepting your offer on a house, then continued to offer the property up for sale to 4/5 other propective buyers and you got "guzzumped" then you offered a bit more and got gazzumped again and again effectively creating an auction?

I would think you'd be a bit..... miffed, to say the least

But you're saying that we (as in plumbers, heating eng's etc) should be happy to stand in a room and bid each other down, its something I will never do

Some quotes you may have a bit of room for negotiation, but not all

Pay peanuts, expect monkeys

 

[A1P]

I don't see why it is "alarming" that not everyone followed you through the door?!

If you're hungry, you're hungry and will quote for the work. I don't see it being rude, at the end of the day when visiting a customer or potential customer you're there to give a quote it is essentially tendering for work. What is the difference between giving a quote infront of other customers and tendering for work online?

I have been hungry for work and still look on any new customer as 'gold dust.'However I am pretty sure I would not have even got inside and would certainly have walked had I done so.I wouldn't necessarily blame anyone who stayed,that is their choice.
However the question you have to ask is 'What sort of customers are you looking for?'I was going through some old paperwork the other day and saw a number of old ,failed quotes.The things that they had in common were,they were very cheap as I was finding it hard to get work and that even then they were not cheap enough for these customers who had one thing in common ,it was all about price.As is often pointed out in the forum there are customers who value you and your work and those who would drop you for a £5 or because you can't get to them immediately.A customer who had the bloody cheek to get 5 plumbers there at the same time was rude and brave.It is a wonder they were not shaken warmly by the throat!In effect they had wasted 4 people's time travelling there.It isn't the same as ringing for a ballpark figure.In any case ,even that is largely a waste of time because a good tradesman needs to see the job but not with 4 others!!!You will find that price obsessed customers are often a waste of time.

 

[TBServices]

I'd have walked. I'd never have been the cheapest, and in that situation, it would be impossible to win the job by any other means than being cheap.

 

[Ray Stafford]

But you're saying that we (as in plumbers, heating eng's etc) should be happy to stand in a room and bid each other down, its something I will never do

How many of you guys have, at any point, sent a list of materials to a range of merchants, and then played one off against the other?

How many of you have ordered something, and put your supplier to the trouble of organising it, and then cancelled because you have found a cheaper or better solution elsewhere?

This is is just normal customer behaviour in almost any field. If you run a business then you have to accept that your aspirations and motivations are not the same as your customers'. Sure, you can set up policies and procedures to lessen the impact on you, but there is no point in getting uptight about it. Its just a risk of business life.

 

[Best]

But isn't that what being in a service industry is all about? You are as good as your customers last experience of you.

An old mentor of mine used to say "There is no such thing as a customer list. What you have is a list of people who used you last month. You have to win their business again tomorrow, next week and next month. Never assume that they are your customer - the moment that you do, you are half way to losing them."

Totally agree with that, but if you do work of the highest quality & at low cost for a customer & they then selfishly suddenly insist you do an unnecessary job for them immediately just because they have decided they want something replaced, I would prefer to let them look around.

 

[Best]

How many of you guys have, at any point, sent a list of materials to a range of merchants, and then played one off against the other?

How many of you have ordered something, and put your supplier to the trouble of organising it, and then cancelled because you have found a cheaper or better solution elsewhere?

We all do price around, but there sometimes is a difference between people getting several plumbers to price, say a heating job & plumbers getting prices from different merchants. By this I mean, if I price the identical products from different merchants, then I will get the same products at the cheapest cost, but people getting different quotes from plumbers using identical materials will not get the same standard of workmanship from each plumber that quotes.

That said, some merchants will be better to deal with, stock better & deliver etc than others. I always like to treat merchants with respect, be honest with them & tell them if they are too expensive & not waste their time if possible.

 

[Ray Stafford]

We all do price around, but there sometimes is a difference between people getting several plumbers to price, say a heating job & plumbers getting prices from different merchants. By this I mean, if I price the identical products from different merchants, then I will get the same products at the cheapest cost, but people getting different quotes from plumbers using identical materials will not get the same standard of workmanship from each plumber that quotes.

Same principle applies though.

The job cconsists of labour and materials. Assuming that the materials are constant, the difference is between the quality of the workmanship in the case of choosing an installer, and the quality of service in the case of choosing a merchant.

 

[northcarr]

How many of you guys have, at any point, sent a list of materials to a range of merchants, and then played one off against the other?

How many of you have ordered something, and put your supplier to the trouble of organising it, and then cancelled because you have found a cheaper or better solution elsewhere?

This is is just normal customer behaviour in almost any field. If you run a business then you have to accept that your aspirations and motivations are not the same as your customers'. Sure, you can set up policies and procedures to lessen the impact on you, but there is no point in getting uptight about it. Its just a risk of business life.

Yes I take your point ray there are two sides to the coin and do see yours but one point to note is how many merchants have let down there customer's .I have got the price for the materials while at the counter only to have received a tottaly diffrent price at my month end invoice ,these things are a fact of life it's just business.

 

[A1P]

Totally agree with that, but if you do work of the highest quality & at low cost for a customer & they then selfishly suddenly insist you do an unnecessary job for them immediately just because they have decided they want something replaced, I would prefer to let them look around.

As with a lot of threads on here this one has thrown up some interesting replies.In my earlier post I highlighted the fact that a lot of ignorant customers of all social classes are price obsessed and that are therefore not the sort of customers you want ,unless fairly,desperate.In an ideal world you have a customer/tradesman relationship based on trust.They have confidence in you as a person,the quality of your work and if you can't drop everything for them ,except in a real emergency ,they will wait.Many of mine and their referrals trust my pricing and we both are not offended by an 'Is there room to shave it a little bit?'However Ray does make a fair point regarding not taking a customer for granted.
Rays point about merchant /tradesman pricing is interesting.It is true to the extent that we all try to get a good deal.What I have learned is that if I give virtually all my business to one merchant,in my case a national one,I get their best price and they even tell me where they are uncompetitive if I need a certain make of boiler.For the convenience of top service and one or two 'sweeteners' re-jobs I would not ditch them for a few quid on certain items.I am aware of internet prices and if they do their best it is much better to stay local.It is a pleasure to go share a cuppa.In other words ,I hope I am not an ignorant customer.I try to be the customer I expect to do work for.A bit Mary Poppins but it works for me.

 

[northcarr]

I don't see why it is "alarming" that not everyone followed you through the door?!

If you're hungry, you're hungry and will quote for the work. I don't see it being rude, at the end of the day when visiting a customer or potential customer you're there to give a quote it is essentially tendering for work. What is the difference between giving a quote infront of other customers and tendering for work online?

I do see your point the customers always king, if you ring someone to come and price a job you should have the courtesy to tell them that there will be other plumbers there and you will want a bidding war for the best price ,this is not unreasonable to want the best price but who would turn up knowing that ? If they attend then they know what is required.it is unfair to waste people's time especially if they are self employed sole traders time is money to them.

 

[SimonG]

I don't see why it is "alarming" that not everyone followed you through the door?!

If you're hungry, you're hungry and will quote for the work. I don't see it being rude, at the end of the day when visiting a customer or potential customer you're there to give a quote it is essentially tendering for work. What is the difference between giving a quote infront of other customers and tendering for work online?

Dont mind quoting but that situation is ridiculous. Somebody might just have been treat to a knuckle sandwich for my trouble.

Theres one thing quoting and another thing bidding.

 

[SimonG]

How many of you guys have, at any point, sent a list of materials to a range of merchants, and then played one off against the other?

How many of you have ordered something, and put your supplier to the trouble of organising it, and then cancelled because you have found a cheaper or better solution elsewhere?

This is is just normal customer behaviour in almost any field. If you run a business then you have to accept that your aspirations and motivations are not the same as your customers'. Sure, you can set up policies and procedures to lessen the impact on you, but there is no point in getting uptight about it. Its just a risk of business life.

I dont want to have to do that. I want a merchant to give me their best price for me. I appreciate that a bigger company will have better buying power but i dont want to go in today and pay a pound, in tomorrow and pay a pound fifty for the same thing. Just want consistency. Sometimes i go elsewhere just show i have other options if needed.

 

[Mike Jackson]

I will quite often take a quote from another merchant in. I will still use the merchant that gave me the cheaper price but I like to let them know why I'm not using them for a certain job. I think it gives them a chance to look at their pricing structure. Having said that I don't always go for the cheapest price as sometimes the service is more important.

 

[SimonG]

I will quite often take a quote from another merchant in. I will still use the merchant that gave me the cheaper price but I like to let them know why I'm not using them for a certain job. I think it gives them a chance to look at their pricing structure. Having said that I don't always go for the cheapest price as sometimes the service is more important.

Likewise when i miss out on a bigish job. I like to contact the cust for some feedback on my price vs the one that got the job. Keeps my pricing right or gives me a laugh to see just how little somebody is charging.