Which Worcester Bosch Boiler For Our Home? Please Help!

[ShaunCorbs]

Viessmann 200 is the top of the top no it doesn't include a tank have a look at the 222 for that

So with the 200 you would need a cylinder or go for the combi version

 

[Rob Foster]

Hi Rob,

You make a very good point!

I have been watching a fair few videos on YouTube about Boilers & like the good folks here who suggested something other than WB, there were many who commented about their distaste for them as well so I am taking good heed of this!

All except one guy from the London Boiler Company who is evangelical about them - comes across as a very nice guy but he is the boss of the company so he would say that I suppose!

The ones I had been very seriously considering after advice from here & reading comments on Youtube were:

Valliant
Viessmann
ATAG
Intergas.

Out of these & after the very kind & helpful info recently given, I focused on Valliant & possibly Viessmann if need be.

Does anyone know how the Viessmann Vitodens 111-W Combi with a 46L Built In Water Tank compare with the Valliant Eco-Plus 938 that has been recommended compare & which might be better for my needs?

I ask as it was the only other Storage Combi I could find from both recommended brands & a 46L Tank seems quite large so does it offer any real & meaningful benefits over the smaller Valliant (18L?) tank?

They do a bigger/better(?) model, the Vitodens 200-W but I do not think this one has the built in water tank even though it is a top model?

Obviously, I would not want sacrifice any far more important aspects like energy & cost savings, the modulating feature, smart connectivity/monitoring etc.

Many Thanks!
Bazzy!

ATAG....no contest
Valiant ...2nd choice
My choice is driven by manufacturer and good inside technical info
Centralheatking

 

[Old Account]

Hi Matchless Plumb!

Thanks again for the really great info & confirming Valliant have great aftercare service - that really gives peace of mind!
I presume you meant to say that you would NOT personally go with a Baxi/Ideal etc? I know this may sound bad coming from a total neophyte like me but there is something about them that puts me off!

It seems that Valliant & Viessmann are the most highly regarded so will concentrate on these two brands then - as not many have mentioned either ATAG or Intergas. Also if Valliant/Viessmann are more prevalent then it makes me question how much more expensive parts/servicing might be on an ATAG/Intergas if their network is not as big.

I am so grateful I was able to learn about this modulating issue as I had no idea about it & it certainly sounds like it is a very important feature to have!

I am based in NW London & called Valliant - they got in touch & one of their approved installers is coming round this week to assess things.

Do I have to now buy from them if I get a Valliant or can I shop around & get second opinions & compare prices as they say always get 3 quotes - I am happy to pay for a proper qualified & vetted professional but also do not want to pay over the odds! I am very weary of contacting plumbers from my local Gumtree as I have read some horror stories of shady folks using fake credentials & paperwork!

How can I, as a novice determine if any prices quoted are competitive/reasonable?

I went onto the Vallaint website but it seems there are two versions of Eco Plus models - is the 938 the best/top one may I ask? How big is the storage tank in it?

On a couple of other points - I have already bought a brand new Filter - a Fernox Omega - can I have this fitted instead of the older version Spirotech one that Valliant offer as part of their protection kit & still get the 10 years warranty?

Must I also have a Power Flush Done as well to get the full 10 year warranty? Reason I ask, is our Rads are really old as is all our pipework which is under the floorboards & we have solid flooring & I am concerned that a power flush may cause leaks or splits at weak joints at pipes under floorboards etc & that would be a nightmare to deal with. Could I instead, opt for say New Radiators throughout the house & have a chemical clean/gentle flush instead? How much would any installer charge for a power flush anyway?

You have been great so again, I really am deeply grateful & appreciative!

Many Kind Thanks!
Bazzy!

Hello Bazzy,

I was trying to say I would not go with any of the boilers like ideal, biasi, baxi, feroli, glowworm etc.. my heart is with Vaillant and viessmann in uk.

Atag is a bad choice to be fair but as mentioned my heart is with Vaillant and for your property all you need is A - Vaillant ecotec plus 938 with up to 20 litres of hot water demand. B- Vaillant uniSTORE and the exclusive green IQ 627 which is top notch.

I am based in London too and if you are willing to have a chat in person about the boiler you can let me know. I assume you will not install the boiler before Christmas but early next year ?

Do not contact plumbers via gumtre, what I have seen and heard is not really great.
If I was you I would use the spirotech protection kit as you have to pay either way for the 3 more years it’s either via the filter ( which provides long warrantyies too ) or you could buy the extended warranty.

You do not have to flush but again it depends on your system how dirty it really is. I would definitely do a chemical flush if you are concerned about your pipeworks. If I was you again, I would want the engineer supply and install the boiler as he will know best what’s required and what he will need. If something is missing he could be charging you ...

You can’t go wrong with the Vaillant boilers at all. Obviously the engineer who you are hiring he has to make sure that the boiler he is recommending you is capable of supplying enough hot water for two showers.

Regards

Ron

 

[rpm]

Is Bazzy the house owner or the caretaker? Post#3 confuses the issue.

 

[Bazzy]

Hello Bazzy,

I was trying to say I would not go with any of the boilers like ideal, biasi, baxi, feroli, glowworm etc.. my heart is with Vaillant and viessmann in uk.

Atag is a bad choice to be fair but as mentioned my heart is with Vaillant and for your property all you need is A - Vaillant ecotec plus 938 with up to 20 litres of hot water demand. B- Vaillant uniSTORE and the exclusive green IQ 627 which is top notch.

I am based in London too and if you are willing to have a chat in person about the boiler you can let me know. I assume you will not install the boiler before Christmas but early next year ?

Do not contact plumbers via gumtre, what I have seen and heard is not really great.
If I was you I would use the spirotech protection kit as you have to pay either way for the 3 more years it’s either via the filter ( which provides long warrantyies too ) or you could buy the extended warranty.

You do not have to flush but again it depends on your system how dirty it really is. I would definitely do a chemical flush if you are concerned about your pipeworks. If I was you again, I would want the e orngineer supply and install the boiler as he will know best what’s required and what he will need. If something is missing he could be charging you .

You can’t go wrong with the Vaillant boilers at all. Obviously the engineer who you are hiring he has to make sure that the boiler he is recommending you is capable of supplying enough hot water for two showers.

Regards

Ron

Hi Ron,

All points clearly heard & understood - no way would I consider some one from Gumtree either!

I take it you mean't to say ATAG is "Not" a bad choice over is one?!!

I am quite worried about doing a powerflush tbh 0ur pipework has not been treated in a very long time & if any joints/seals give way under all the floorboards, we would be in real trouble but again, my true understanding of power-flushing is limited!

I would rather take out each Radiator & flush it manually with a hose in the garden whilst also doing a thorough chemical clean of the pipework that you mentioned. Our Rads bar a few are quite old - approaching 15-18 years so may even consider replacing them with more modern, efficient ones if that is a good option.

Where in London are you may I ask - I am in NW London - is that doable for you? You are more than welcome to come round & take a look & we can have a chat - that would be great! can you supply & fit everything once you have had a chance to take a look?

Pity about being only offered the Spirotech Filters - I really wanted to use the Fernox Omega I already purchased - I really do not like the Spirotech ones after seeing videos of how very poorly they performed! How much do they want/charge for their Spirotech Filter to get the extra warranty?

Feel free to get in touch if allowed - most welcome!

Many Kind Thanks!

 

[Bazzy]

Is Bazzy the house owner or the caretaker? Post#3 confuses the issue.

Hi rpm!

Being the youngest male in a dogmatically female dominated house, I am the general expendable dogsbody who gets lumbered with doing all the research & enquiries but like many males in my situation, can only make suggestions - the real decision making power lies with them - if I get it right, the glory goes to them & if I get it wrong, then my head is in the chopping block - it's not a fair world!

Bazzy!

 

[Old Account]

Hi Ron,

All points clearly heard & understood - no way would I consider some one from Gumtree either!

I take it you mean't to say ATAG is "Not" a bad choice over is one?!!

I am quite worried about doing a powerflush tbh 0ur pipework has not been treated in a very long time & if any joints/seals give way under all the floorboards, we would be in real trouble but again, my true understanding of power-flushing is limited!

I would rather take out each Radiator & flush it manually with a hose in the garden whilst also doing a thorough chemical clean of the pipework that you mentioned. Our Rads bar a few are quite old - approaching 15-18 years so may even consider replacing them with more modern, efficient ones if that is a good option.

Where in London are you may I ask - I am in NW London - is that doable for you? You are more than welcome to come round & take a look & we can have a chat - that would be great! can you supply & fit everything once you have had a chance to take a look?

Pity about being only offered the Spirotech Filters - I really wanted to use the Fernox Omega I already purchased - I really do not like the Spirotech ones after seeing videos of how very poorly they performed! How much do they want/charge for their Spirotech Filter to get the extra warranty?

Feel free to get in touch if allowed - most welcome!

Many Kind Thanks!

Atag is not a bad choice, that’s correct in fact it has a passive flue gas heat recovery unit which will re use the old flue gases to pre heat the incoming mains cold water within the boiler which will reduce the amount of gas consumption.

It would be a bad idea of changing some of your radiators when installing a new system. If your budget allows you to change them that would be the right time. Perhaps, if you haven’t got yet thermostatic radiator valves installed that would be another recommendation from my site.

I am in E- London perhaps about 40min away from you. However, it would be doable for me to visit you and perhaps talk the works over. I do not think spirotech is done poorly in fact I believe they are done quite good. For example I would recommend of installing a deaerator to take the micro bubbles out of the system. I find them very good and they have got long warranties too. I probably would do a chemical flush Instead but it will need to be checked how dirty your system actually is.

Regards

Ron

 

[Bazzy]

Atag is not a bad choice, that’s correct in fact it has a passive flue gas heat recovery unit which will re use the old flue gases to pre heat the incoming mains cold water within the boiler which will reduce the amount of gas consumption.

It would be a bad idea of changing some of your radiators when installing a new system. If your budget allows you to change them that would be the right time. Perhaps, if you haven’t got yet thermostatic radiator valves installed that would be another recommendation from my site.

I am in E- London perhaps about 40min away from you. However, it would be doable for me to visit you and perhaps talk the works over. I do not think spirotech is done poorly in fact I believe they are done quite good. For example I would recommend of installing a deaerator to take the micro bubbles out of the system. I find them very good and they have got long warranties too. I probably would do a chemical flush Instead but it will need to be checked how dirty your system actually is.

Regards

Ron

Hi Ron,

Thanks kindly again & advising about the Rads! Do you have that fancy FLIR thermal Imaging Camera that can see inside the rads for sludge etc? It would give me a good idea what the insides are kind of like!

I saw a video on Youtube where a team of Plumbers did two runs of a PowerFlush & 2 x Magnacleanses but even then, they had to physically take the rads off & flush them manually outside with a hose & it was incredible the amount of sludge & crud that still came out even after 2 x Powerflushes & 2 x Magnacleanses!

Our's have not had anything done in about 15-20 years but last time I checked a couple of years ago, the water was still coming out clear when I had to bleed them - I wonder if any sludge that might there might have no solidified inside the rads or is this not possible?

Someone also told me that due to the age of the rads, even though they look perfectly normal on the exterior, they are probably rusted badly inside - is this likely?

Just another question if I can so I can try & learn/understand - on the Valliant 938 the internal tank is I think 18L/20L but on the Viessmann 111-W, it is 46L which is more than double - what are the advantages/benefits of this as well as the downsides?

I ask as it seems quite a huge difference & sizes & there must be a reason why Valliant chose to put a smaller 18L/20L tank & Viessmann a much larger 46L one? Would not the larger one be better/offer more performance etc?

I have sent you a PM regarding meeting up & your checking things out!

Many Kind Thanks!
Bazzy!

 

[Andrew Serrant]

Check out the viessman 111 that is wall hung and has Internal hot water store. Before you go with vaillant check out common faults ,in my experience the ecotec boilers had problems with pressure sensors,gas valves,pcb,thermal link in heat exchangers ,leaking diverter valves ect . Not sure that's the same with the new models . In my opinion WB have the best customer service and offer 10 y gauruntee not warantee no quibble as long as the boiler was installed by an accredited installer and serviced every year . If the pipe work and old radiators are not in good order I would be very careful about pressurising the system, new pipes and rads best option .

 

[Old Account]

Check out the viessman 111 that is wall hung and has Internal hot water store. Before you go with vaillant check out common faults ,in my experience the ecotec boilers had problems with pressure sensors,gas valves,pcb,thermal link in heat exchangers ,leaking diverter valves ect . Not sure that's the same with the new models . In my opinion WB have the best customer service and offer 10 y gauruntee not warantee no quibble as long as the boiler was installed by an accredited installer and serviced every year . If the pipe work and old radiators are not in good order I would be very careful about pressurising the system, new pipes and rads best option .

The Vaillant 938 has the same built in storage which supplies up 20l. Basically you will never run out of hot water and is definitely made for such a property. Never came across issues you have mentioned unless the boiler had been miss treated and not serviced. Aftercare is down to each individual and I can only say I had very bad experience with Worcester Bosch and therefore would not recommend them. Vaillant has a spot on aftercare and supplying 10 years of warranty too with an accredited engineer and Vaillant protection kit.

Everyone has their own favourite manufacturers. However, if it comes to quality Vaillant is by far the best boiler. Vaillant isnt without a reason market leader for many many years. Vaillant is known for their innovative and efficient products, for intelligent smart controls and top service. Moreover known for comfort and good design.
Brands like saunier duval, awb, glow worm, bulex or protherm as well as demir döküm are a very important market portfolio for Vaillant group. Those brands are justified for the demand and middle class prices and stand for uncomplicated and reliable heating technology.

 

[Bazzy]

Hi All,

A very happy new year to all!

I just wish to express to very sincere & deep gratitude to all here for helping me out - I am so grateful & have learned quite a bit!

A special thanks to Matchless.plumb/Ron for really being a top bloke & for the consistent help & advice given - Ron, I would be more than happy to buy you a beer or few - just let me know when!

Due to the extreme pressure we were under at being without hot water over the Xmas/New Year period & with lack of availability of plumbers during this period & that we could not really wait much longer - we finally made a choice!

I had some installers come round from Valiant/Viessman etc but some of their install quotes were just eye wateringly high tbh. Maybe it was a seasonal thing - I do not know.

Initially, I was deeply considering the Valiant 938 (as very strongly recommended by Ron) & the Viessmann 111-W each of which have in built storage tanks at 20L & 46L respectively.

It was a very close call but I was at the mercy of time & installer availability as well as finding one who would install at a reasonable cost.

As things turned out, I was able to get a very good deal on a Viessmann 222-F Boiler with the built in 130L Tank as recommended earlier here but had to act quickly to secure it so I went ahead. I also was able to finally find a Viessmann Trained Installer who is also Gas Safe Registered who gave me a much more reasonable install quote compared to others.

Unfortunately Ron, I just could not wait for your return from Germany as I was getting just too much grief from the others in the house otherwise I would have loved for you to give a quote/do the install.

I was able to get the 222-F with Weather Compensation for really not much more than a 111-W or 938 & even with the install costs added, it was still working out cheaper than the quotes I had for the 111-W & 938 and since we had the space to accommodate the 222-F decided to go for it as we just could not wait any longer.

Thanks again deeply to all who have helped me & to Matchless.plumb/Ron, I am sorry I did not go with the Valliant 938 you very kindly & honestly steered me to but I hope you can forgive me & still feel I have got a good boiler & a good deal?

Many Kind Thanks,
Bazzy!

 

[ShaunCorbs]

Great pic the 222 is the best of the best

Any install pics ?

 

[Bazzy]

Great pic the 222 is the best of the best

Any install pics ?

Hi!

It has yet to be installed - work starting Monday but when it is all done, I will surely post pics here - hopefully you will all agree that it was installed properly & correctly!

Many Thanks,
Bazzy!

 

[Old Account]

Hi Bazzy,
I wish you all the best and don’t you worry about not giving me the opportunity. I am happy you came on here and we all couldn’t be a very good help to you. We are happy that someone comes back and gives a detailed update which is quite rare. However, you have choosen a top Boiler to be fair you cannot go wrong with either one of them. I would be delighted to get some updates from you when the install has finished! Thank you for letting us all know and good luck for the installation Bazzy! Thank you for offering the beer but I do not drink any type of alcohol but it is much appreciate it. We are happy to help !!!

 

[Old Account]

Hi!

It has yet to be installed - work starting Monday but when it is all done, I will surely post pics here - hopefully you will all agree that it was installed properly & correctly!

Many Thanks,
Bazzy!

I hoping for the best.