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Foreigners? I mean jobs.

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When i worked for bg doing work outside the business was gross misconduct, instant dismissal if found out.

The MD, chaiman and board members all sat as non execs on other boards earning more dollar for their already bulging bank accounts.

Now that is double standards.
 
I would say 9/10 people doing foreigners use their bosses stock. It is so easy to do though. I installed a full central heating system in a house I lived in and all the fittings, rad valves, clips, gas, solder etc was provided by the company I worked for. (I didn't even pay for the radiators but that was not through the company)

That to me is why anybody doing a foreigner would be gone in a shot.

I understand that there are people out there that are setting up for themselves who do work evenings and weekends and have all the costs but most of them still take stock off the bosses.

The old boy that taught me used to do a boiler every weekend (this was before you had to register them) and he used to build his stock up during the week then use it at the weekend. The boss found out because as mike said a customer took the number off the side of the van and couldn't get hold of him so phoned the company. That then made the boss stop all the lads using the vans outside of work and he got a warning (he was never going to get rid of him as he was the only gas installer they had)

Exactly why I'm getting a stock control systems set up for our business. If someone nicks stock I will soon know!
 
I would of thought impossible for fittings though as you can't really know 100% what fittings you need for each job. The larger things then yes easy enough.

As long as people don't take the mick it's quite hard to spot, if like a lad I used to work with you book a bundle of 15mm for every job then you can tell straight away, I heard rumours the boss called him in and said if you haven't got 5 bundles of 15mm on the van make sure you bring a lot of cash with you.
 
Simple stock tracking is easy to do. We have bins in the van for every item we stock. We barcode each bin and the lads scan everything they take in and out of the van. Sounds like a nightmare but it's very simple to do, they just do it on their mobile phone. When we count the stock any errors suggest it's been nicked!
 
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Even though i'm working for someone on a self employed basis, it's long term, the boss has said i have a job as long as i want. He provides the van (i crash it 😛 ) and fuel, I have just started having to pay my own insurance as are the other 3 guys. It's fair enough.

I don't earn a great deal but boss is fairly laid back 95% of the time and rarely hassles us to get jobs finished. It's not always the most organised and don't always get told the right information for jobs so there's only so much pressure he can expect us to take. Also i'm still gaining experience.

He has said to me that he is ok with us doing our own jobs. I have used their fittings but then I have also had a few lengths of pipe on the van i paid for and ended up using on their jobs. When I have to pay and display i never put the tickets in to get my money back. It's pretty much evens for me. I have passed the company details on for jobs too.

I stay late to get jobs finished or do extra after my hours on a regular basis where as the other guys are getting itchy feet at 4 pm and at 31 minutes past are sweating and getting annoyed.

I would say my loyalty is pretty good. I would like to be busy enough on my own one day to go full time and if that day ever comes I would give 4 weeks notice even though I don't have to. I could get a text tonight saying no more work and that would be it.
 
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Simple stock tracking is easy to do. We have bins in the van for every item we stock. We barcode each bin and the lads scan everything they take in and out of the van. Sounds like a nightmare but it's very simple to do, they just do it on their mobile phone. When we count the stock any errors suggest it's been nicked!
Be careful kieran whilst i think it is an excellent way of keeping control of stock. You also need to take into account user error. And stuff being put back that isn't re entered back onto the system and stuff that is knackered that may be thrown away without them remembering you need to made aware of it.
 
Yes definitely. I would certainly err on the side of caution before accusing someone of stealing! The odd item going missing is one thing but lots of items would be another!
 
Simple stock tracking is easy to do. We have bins in the van for every item we stock. We barcode each bin and the lads scan everything they take in and out of the van. Sounds like a nightmare but it's very simple to do, they just do it on their mobile phone. When we count the stock any errors suggest it's been nicked!

Just hypothetically say I work for you, I'm on a job and I book out 10 15mm elbows viva barcode but then I get my pipe bender out and machine bend 6 of the elbows but put the fittings in my pocket, how do you know, if you see what I mean
 
I dont but it gets charged to the job. At this stage I have a good idea what fittings will be used as I see each job. As the business grows it will be harder to keep an eye on it. No system is perfect but it will make it a lot harder for employees to nick from me.
 
I dont but it gets charged to the job. At this stage I have a good idea what fittings will be used as I see each job. As the business grows it will be harder to keep an eye on it. No system is perfect but it will make it a lot harder for employees to nick from me.
I'm not saying the idea isn't great or wont work, I think its a brilliant idea
But employee imput will be the only downfall
 
I agree. We've already trialled a system from America that was very good but was far too expensive for a small business. We've decided to get our own designed for us, the trial showed me it saves me huge amounts of time and cuts out running around for that bit you don't have when you need it!

Getting back on track though, it will just be another tool that could be used to catch dodgy employees! We don't have that problem in Lincoln with our business luckily. Both my employees are stars. I completely forgot though, I had someone that was nabbing bits and pieces from me in Hampshire (an apprentice) and he got the boot very quickly when I found out. Being Scottish, I'm eagle eyed and I soon worked out things were going missing.
 
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Yes definitely. I would certainly err on the side of caution before accusing someone of stealing! The odd item going missing is one thing but lots of items would be another!

You soon get a good idea of what is random error and what is stealing. It stands out a mile off if you have good reporting over a decent time frame.

The two things that always amazes me are:

1) the number of people who find ways of cheating us in the short term
2) the surprised look on their face when we catch them in the end

The killer factor in all employee thefts is time and repetition.

You can cheat me once. But try to cheat me multiple times, and the stats will find you out. Not "sometimes". Not "mostly" Always!
 
my old govenor used to say your braekfast we will pay for ,your lunch we will assist but im fecked if im paying for your supper
 
its a funny old world now years ago there were perks to every trade and occupation with the use of computers every bean is now counted so no one gets any perks unless you are on a salary where you no longer need them then the freebies roll in, top of the pile is politicians
 
Two examples (credit to writer and researcher Dan Ariely)

Dan said:
An eight year old boy is sent home with a note from his teacher reporting the fact that he stole a pencil from a classmate. That evening the boy gets a stern talking to from his father, who lectures him on the importance of honesty and how he should never abuse the trust that others place in him. Finally in an attempt to understand the boy’s motives and to prevent it from happening again the exasperated father asks his son, “why would you ever steal a pencil when you know that I can bring you 10 home from work?”

While this is an illustrative example, the hypocrisy with which honesty is sometimes applied is genuine and it conveys the point well of how easily we all to some degree apply double standards.

To establish real proof of this human condition American researchers set up an experiment in a student residence which housed 200 post graduates on MIT university’s campus. The moral trap they set involved placing 30 cans of Coke in the common room fridge and placing 30 individual $1 notes on a nearby counter.

With the student traffic passing through the common room it took a mere 2 hours for the 30 cokes to be stolen but oddly none of the $1 notes went missing. The conclusion was that despite the cost of a can of Coke costing roughly S1 in the vending machine in the same residence, the act of taking someone else’s cold Coke on a sunny Cambridge afternoon is a whole lot “less stealing” that stealing a dollar.

Dan has written an excellent book on the grey areas around honesty, and how we convince ourself that when we do something its a "perk" but when someone else does it, its a crime.
 
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@Steve, You call it perks, I call it stealing. I happen to think employees get a very good perk - they always know how much they will be paid at the end of the month. I'm on a salary and dividends and for the first time ever last year I paid myself a decent wage, i.e. substantially more than I would get if I was employed as a plumber & electrician combined. For the 5 years previous to that I would have earned much more money working for someone else. In years 1 and 2 I would have earnt more doing a minimum wage job anywhere, despite working 60 hour weeks routinely. From where I'm looking being employed is financially a very good deal. I am self employed because I see the potential (year 7 looks as though it will be as good or better than year 6) and I like being fully in control of my own life.

If someone asks me if they can have some fittings from my van for a job at their house I would most likely say yes (as long as we aren't talking silly amounts). All of the lads can buy stuff for their home at cost price through our business. Equally they can use any of the tools in the vans for work in their home. If they have larger work in their homes needing done, if we can do it we do it for them for zero labour cost. We all do those jobs in each other's houses that we can't be bothered doing when we get home!

Additionally the lads get a decent sized profit share in their paycheck at the end of November each year. They get 6 weeks of annual leave a year. They get decent quality uniform and above average pay for the area. So with all of that in mind I certainly wouldn't expect them to be taking my stock and using it on 'foreigners'.

If someone takes my parts/fittings without asking me, sorry but it's theft, plain and simple. I'd sack them without question and call the police about the matter. I have to pay to replace stolen items and thus our business earns less profit which makes it less likely I will employ someone else next year. It would have a real knock-on effect on our business. I'm sorry but I think it's right to keep tabs on stock for that reason. Employees who are honest have nothing to worry about.
 
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Croft what salary do you pay your plumbers? I don't see how anyone can live comfortably of a paye plumbers wage without doing jobs to bump up their money? Gas boys yes but not plumbers
 
All the guys who join my company start off as an apprentice at college and I teach them myself. All of the apprentices who join my company will start on £2.80 an hour for (worst case) the first year. My most senior staff member got a pay rise from this after 6 months but sometimes it takes a bit longer before they actually start helping out instead of being a drain on time if you know what I mean.

My year 2 apprentice who is just wrapping up his college now gets £7.25/hr. This is above the JIB rate of £6.73/hr for someone at his position. He gets a company van as well and does quite a lot of small jobs for me. In return he gets to use the van when he wants as long as he tops it up with fuel. They all get 6 weeks a year paid leave and the profit share this year is looking like £1,000 each, paid in November. If someone isn't worth paying this much to at the end of their first year then it's time for them to go sadly.

The guys get regular appraisals every 6 months and they are very clear about what objectives they have to meet during the year to get a pay rise at the end of the year.

Once they are out of year 1 of their apprenticeship (i.e. have proven themselves) all my staff will always get over the JIB rate. We charge top prices in our company so it wouldn't be fair not to. I'm hoping this means they won't be encouraged to look elsewhere.

I do get that cost of living is very high and plumbers (employed) don't earn a fortune. When I struggled for cash when I was younger though I got a second job, I didn't steal from my employer!
 
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