kinked, crimped and coiled 8mm pipework

[1animal1]

Can you chaps help please

I'm just working out where my 3 22mm pipes will enter the garage where the boiler and cylinder will be sited. I've looked into the calculations for notching and or drilling joints and trying to work out the best path. The rear of the garage is a simple breeze block so gather the boiler would have to be on the outside wall...

My question is, as the joist above the rear garage wall runs proud. It means that if I drop my pipes by notches, then they will enter the garage through the ceiling about 3-4 inch from the wall. Easily sorted with a few 90's, however I'm just wondering if that will hinder the flow much with it being so close to a few 90's so early on

 

[ShaunCorbs]

Can you chaps help please

I'm just working out where my 3 22mm pipes will enter the garage where the boiler and cylinder will be sited. I've looked into the calculations for notching and or drilling joints and trying to work out the best path. The rear of the garage is a simple breeze block so gather the boiler would have to be on the outside wall...

My question is, as the joist above the rear garage wall runs proud. It means that if I drop my pipes by notches, then they will enter the garage through the ceiling about 3-4 inch from the wall. Easily sorted with a few 90's, however I'm just wondering if that will hinder the flow much with it being so close to a few 90's so early on

Use two 45 and make an offset

 

[1animal1]

Thanks Shaun, I can't see a way around it without hacking the joists and adding even more bends to get them beneath the joists, which I'd obviously like to avoid.

One thing on the joist calcs, it mentions minimum and maximum distance from the ends as to where you can notch. Is there any issues doing one big notch at Max depth (23mm) for two of the 22mm's? With a bit of underlay between them

 

[PhoenixServices]

Depending on the thickness and depth of the joist, that should've done. Most flow+ returns for heating are run like this.

 

[1animal1]

Thanks phoenix, they are 8inch joists @ 2.6m across, apologies for the curious cross measurements.

Calculator I used gives me 2 or 3 mm extra over the depth of the 22mm to avoid the boards above. One cut was done near the end of the joist 50mm from the minimum safe by the original fitter for a piece of 15mm, so I thought rather than cut a third notch, just expand that one given its already there

 

[ShaunCorbs]

Thanks Shaun, I can't see a way around it without hacking the joists and adding even more bends to get them beneath the joists, which I'd obviously like to avoid.

One thing on the joist calcs, it mentions minimum and maximum distance from the ends as to where you can notch. Is there any issues doing one big notch at Max depth (23mm) for two of the 22mm's? With a bit of underlay between them

Do it like this, ignore the sizes

 

[1animal1]

I'll drop the pipes down in that case and let my plumber cut and put some copper 45's in to make it look neat and tidy.

 

[ShaunCorbs]

I'll drop the pipes down in that case and let my plumber cut and put some copper 45's in to make it look neat and tidy.

Drop the pipes 3 - 4 inches below the ceiling

 

[1animal1]

Evening all.

I have yet another question about bath taps. I know there's no reason to use 22mm to the bath if using a combi, I also know to use 22mm if you have a vented cylinder. Is there likely to be a noticeable downside to running the final 2m in 15mm from my 22mm feed pipe assuming I use 1/2 taps? Thinking pressure, but will it be that noticeable on a pressurised unvented system

 

[ShaunCorbs]

no you will be fine get as far as you can with 22mm (easily) then 15mm from there

 

[1animal1]

Excellent, thanks Shaun....

 

[1animal1]

Radiators.... Old ones to be exact. I gather they're worthless and I should take them to the tip? I only have 3 mediums to go

 

[ShaunCorbs]

Yea worth nothing unless you have a ton and yes or to a scrap man

 

[1animal1]

Stage 1 complete! I have removed the 2nd rad in the large room, soaking myself in the process as i only needed to cap two pipes - luckily it was only mains pressure (I would have had to drain otherwise).

I have also ran the extension to the rad feed ready for this to be soldered by my plumber, and placed the hot water feed parallel with 22mm copper then onto a 22x15x15 tee (to main bathroom and en suite shower)... my only query at this point was that i had to create an S bend in the 15mm going to this tee, it's tight but hasn't kinked, though it wouldn't enter the tee easily, so i removed it from the 22mm pipe to fit the 15's, then reconnected to the 22mm which seems to have done the trick - I imagine this will hold with superseal inserts pushed fully home even though there's a pressure from the pipe S bend on the fitting? (The S is spread between 1 beam cavity).

Thankfully the main bath feed went down one beam cavity - the shower had to cross multiple beams for which there was existing notches from an old pipe route, these are either just below (2mm) or rest on the floorboards, but are definitely not squashed by them - although i expect plastic pipe on boards won't have the same issue you get with the banging copper variants.

 

[ShaunCorbs]

Post a pic up of your s bend thing if you can

 

[1animal1]

Not really, easily - the boards are back down.

With the sounds, it could be a potential issue? the 15mm pipe exits the top of the beam and heads at roughly 35 degrees towards the tee, then bends another 35 degree when it gets to entering the tee.

 

[1animal1]

Shaun, I decided to remove the boards again and fit a 135 elbow on the off chance the angle was too tight, rather be safe than sorry for the sake of £3.50

You can also see the new 22mm feed in the top right of the picture, I need to get my plumber to attach that the pipe with the bend in. Nice bit of tight soldering required

 

[ShaunCorbs]

two problems i see is

no felt on timbers (copper pipe) so will make nosie when heating

jg ring is too close to timber if pipe is pulled changes of it pushing the ring in

and whats with the yellow glove finger?

 

[1animal1]

View attachment 24727

 

[Best]

What a mess. That soldered tee doesn't look good. Perhaps leaking

 

[1animal1]

Haha the rubber finger was a way to keep the pipe sealed as I'm not sure when the plumber can attach. As you can see here it'll be a pain to do... Luckily the 15mm running to the feed can be removed now, the 15mm return will have to be capped at a later date otherwise it'll be too difficult to relocate before the new system is fitted.

Regards the ring being too close, I did think that but upon locking the joint, that ring also locks, or appears to? I can shorten the 15mm going to it easily enough, that will pull the 22mm out where I originally fitted it... Or further up the run a clip could solve that issue.

Underlay... I hadn't bothered as these pipes are just ever so slightly too high, not because of the notches but because of the join art the bend being too proud. When my chap puts a tee in there I'm hoping that will address that issue and sink the pipes a few mm into the notches

 

[1animal1]

What a mess. That soldered tee doesn't look good. Perhaps leaking

It's not great is it. That joint luckily isn't leaking but will be removed when the T gets installed to the downstairs feed... Where the yellow finger is

 

[Best]

You really need pipes notched in centre of each board. And it is much better to put only one pipe in below each board. That way you have no damage to joist and plenty of joist to screw board to, but also plenty of space between each pipe for soldering and bending pipes to tees

 

[1animal1]

That would have been the ideal, I've not actually cut any notches apart from the hot water feed with the 22x15x15 jg connection. I'm just trying to make the best of what was done originally.

Question... When I convert the feed and returns to the rads to 15mm, the plan is to use holes mid beam as there are a couple of points where notches won't be possible. Can you buy stubby bits to get the makita between the beams to drill? Gathering angled holes won't be good for the joists

 

[ShaunCorbs]

use a side drill/ angle drill and stubby augers