Worc Bosch took 20 minutes for boiler "service"

[Paul-Worc Bosch]

Re: Worc Bosch took 20 minutes for boiler "service". BEWARE - DID THEY SKIP SAFETY CH

SimonG,


My initial post does come across as heavy handed, so I can understand your view. But that’s not how I’ve dealt with WB so far. They’ve received nothing but polite, though I admit firm phone calls and two factual emails. I’ve had a service that their own manager agrees was not sufficient, waited weeks for replies to my complaint, and then this morning got dropped in , plus WB had no intention of ever calling me to reschedule today’s missed visit.


I really don’t think I’ve brought this upon myself.


Gasmannxxx,


I live in Sunderland. I would appreciate a contact for a good independent. I’m sure WB will come good in the end, but I no longer think they are the best solution for me.

 

[hammers4spanner]

Re: Worc Bosch took 20 minutes for boiler "service". BEWARE - DID THEY SKIP SAFETY CH

If i'm right this thread is all about someone takin 20 mins to do in your opinion 45 mins of work for £200 ,

maybe the previous service engineers were stringing out 20 mins worth of work over 45 ??

 

[Nostrum]

Re: Worc Bosch took 20 minutes for boiler "service". BEWARE - DID THEY SKIP SAFETY CH

Maybe he was in a rush to catch a plane to go on holiday?

 

[Rickster123]

Re: Worc Bosch took 20 minutes for boiler "service". BEWARE - DID THEY SKIP SAFETY CH

Maybe just maybe he's that damn good at his job!

 

[bewsh]

Re: Worc Bosch took 20 minutes for boiler "service". BEWARE - DID THEY SKIP SAFETY CH

To be fair, I can easily complete a service on a Greenstar in 20 minutes -. Analyse is whilst checking working pressure, fan pressure and gas rate - adjust the readings in max/min if required and once they are correct, test the FSD and you're away!

That's why I always love reading Greenstar in the job history on the laptop, you know you're in for an easy job!

 

[pierrot]

Re: Worc Bosch took 20 minutes for boiler "service". BEWARE - DID THEY SKIP SAFETY CH

I assume for your 200 quid it includes call outs and parts replacement, so the service and safety check is only a part of what your paying for.

 

[Koogatubac]

Worcesters are all i fit now, theres nothing to em really. 20mins sounds like a fast time but it an't if your boiler is under 6yrs. After that i believe they advise you to inspect certain parts and replace the seals if i remember from a factory tour.

If your not having any problems dont worry. Or if you are, ask for a service report and a copy of FGA. I always staple a copy of FGA to the benchmark and service book.

 

[DirksPlumbing]

Worcesters are all i fit now, theres nothing to em really. 20mins sounds like a fast time but it an't if your boiler is under 6yrs. After that i believe they advise you to inspect certain parts and replace the seals if i remember from a factory tour.

If your not having any problems dont worry. Or if you are, ask for a service report and a copy of FGA. I always staple a copy of FGA to the benchmark and service book.

I am aware of the figures WB gives you. And in an ideal world this would work out. For example they tell you that the heat exchanger on the Ri can get changed in 20 minutes. Just it does not allow the 30 minutes to carefully trying to lift it of the baked on connection. Which finally only succeeded under slight malformation of the casing due to the required brute force.

WB as well tells you that the boilers come preset from factory. Especially when you do commission them properly you would have found in the past at least every fifth of the LPG boilers completely off and requiring a complete setup.

How quick can you check the expansion vessel? And how often they need recharging? 20 minutes for a complete service?
I asked my exboss to show me how that is done as he came with this funny idea too. Surprisingly he skipped this option to improve the efficiency of his plumbers by miles.

 

[lame plumber]

20 mins on a wb is easily achievable, the hard thing is to find something to do so the custard isnt ****ed off with you doing it in 20 mins. All it is as has been said is fga, fan vacuum pressure, if condensate trap is clean no taking it off and input pressure to cover your bum and done! Ifa visual proves no leaks then off and away. If your coughing £200 a year for servicing alone them wb are on to a good deal, if its for repairs then whats your issue?

 

[DirksPlumbing]

I

20 mins on a wb is easily achievable, the hard thing is to find something to do so the custard isnt ****ed off with you doing it in 20 mins. All it is as has been said is fga, fan vacuum pressure, if condensate trap is clean no taking it off and input pressure to cover your bum and done! Ifa visual proves no leaks then off and away. If your coughing £200 a year for servicing alone them wb are on to a good deal, if its for repairs then whats your issue?

This is how I get and keep a lot of customers. Checking the expansion vessel is essential. The usual thing then is the customer complaining about constant pressure loss. The frequent refills will have caused by that time plenty of corrosion. And the system is sludged up causing expensive repairs. And all that for laziness or inability to read the MIs.

 

[lame plumber]

so if a boiler is operating ok and system pressure isnt rising rapidly and prv isnt leaking etc isnt that a good indication the expansion vessel is ok? your also supposed to check prvs on a service according to most mis but I never touch them as that normally starts a problem. the most important part of any service is asking the custard if everything is ok, regular fills required? etc. Last thing I want to be doing is draining out water to then be filling it with fresh water to encourage corrosion, which is what you do by checking a functioning expn vessel iaw mis. each to his own but best not to be calling people lazy and illiterate

 

[plumber0808]

This is why I take my time doing a service if I know its complete in about 20 mins which certainly can be done.

i had this in the week on the way home 2year old WBosch. All working fine but I didn't want to complete it to quickly for the reasons that you are so angry about.was done in 45 mins.

the service has probably been done correctly but they have so many to do on their list for the day they don't want to hang about and why should they. The reason I did is because it was a new customer for me so 25 mins faffing might get me more work.

 

[DirksPlumbing]

so if a boiler is operating ok and system pressure isnt rising rapidly and prv isnt leaking etc isnt that a good indication the expansion vessel is ok? your also supposed to check prvs on a service according to most mis but I never touch them as that normally starts a problem. the most important part of any service is asking the custard if everything is ok, regular fills required? etc. Last thing I want to be doing is draining out water to then be filling it with fresh water to encourage corrosion, which is what you do by checking a functioning expn vessel iaw mis. each to his own but best not to be calling people lazy and illiterate

Sounds you are basing your boiler service on the assumption it might be right, possibly. But you have not checked it? Where does that take us? Assuming that the gas pipe has no leaks? Assuming that the combustion might be okay? Assuming the condensate trap will last another year?

Suppose the customer was assuming too. In specific that you did the job you expect to be paid for.

By starting to look at the expansion vessel you will be amazed how much these can tell you about the system.
And you can actually combine the test for the PRV with the expansion vessel test.

If it gets done regularly you would not face the problems with not sealing PRVs.

With the laziness I have not finger pointed. Here I was assuming that only the ones take it on board that should do. If you do a good service for your customers nobody will complain.

 

[hammers4spanner]

there is no specific requiremnt to do a TT on a boiler service

 

[lame plumber]

hang on dirk, whos assuming combustion is ok if you do an fga, who has to do a tightness test on a service according to the rules, it would seem you assume to much. Most people will not use a prv to drain down as it can destroy the seating and if the vessel is operating ok why is there a need to test it? If it fails it doesnt work if its working its ok. if your servicing the same boiler regularly then you know its history and any issues, if you see it for the first time then its best to spend a little more time on it in my opinion. All thats been said here is that if you follow the wb servicing mis then its perfectly feasable to do the lot in 20 mins. After all even the wb training dept have stated its simple and quick to service a jnr or cdi as theres so little to do if its working ok. they dont mention being lazy or not being able to read. I prefer to leave a service knowing i wont get a call back when the prv fails a few days down the line having fiddled with it.

 

[gassafe]

In real life no-one isolates the boiler, drains it down & tests / pump up expansion! Plus then opens the prv to check it operates!

If the pressure is stable, with no high rise & the customer confirms no frequent top up then that to me confirms an okay vessel!

If I isolate the boiler, the valves will probably start leaking. The schrader valve will then start passing, the prv will continually drip after opening & the customer certainly won't be thanking me for now saying I need to replace parts!

I think with knowledge & experiences engineers can tell alot about the boiler without following books by the letter!

Its like the old boilers that tell us to completely strip the boiler, removing fan, burner nozzle, etc etc, we don't do those parts either if its going to break seals that we then have to source & replace!!

 

[gassafe]

Your better off checking the expansion vessel next time the system is drained for any reason! Saves touching old valves, or touching the prv!

Anyone who opens a prv on a greenstar situated at the back of the hydronic block is asking for trouble! I hope you have not got any jobs booked in after that service if you do lol!

 

[dancinplumba]

Your better off checking the expansion vessel next time the system is drained for any reason! Saves touching old valves, or touching the prv!

Anyone who opens a prv on a greenstar situated at the back of the hydronic block is asking for trouble! I hope you have not got any jobs booked in after that service if you do lol!

Had to change one yesterday, ball ache, crap boiler, crap design. Good earner tho haha

 

[gassafe]

Had to change one yesterday, ball ache, crap boiler, crap design. Good earner tho haha

That will teach you to test the prv... Lol

 

[gassafe]

Had to change one yesterday, ball ache, crap boiler, crap design. Good earner tho haha

I've not had the pleasure yet! Did you take out the block or lift the boiler off the wall?

 

[DirksPlumbing]

In real life no-one isolates the boiler, drains it down & tests / pump up expansion! Plus then opens the prv to check it operates!

If the pressure is stable, with no high rise & the customer confirms no frequent top up then that to me confirms an okay vessel!

If I isolate the boiler, the valves will probably start leaking. The schrader valve will then start passing, the prv will continually drip after opening & the customer certainly won't be thanking me for now saying I need to replace parts!

I think with knowledge & experiences engineers can tell alot about the boiler without following books by the letter!

Its like the old boilers that tell us to completely strip the boiler, removing fan, burner nozzle, etc etc, we don't do those parts either if its going to break seals that we then have to source & replace!!

I assume. I better should not comment on this.
And no, spiking pressure is a sign only of either incomplete service or a faulty expansion vessel. Picture your expansion vessel like a car tyre. Are you driving till there is no pressure left? This usually leaves the customer with a hefty fine for replacing the vessel as then it had started rusting (gap corrosion) and piercing the membrane.

If you try to reinflate one of those poor ignored vessels they typically break down.

Same with the PRV. These are actually built to reseal. But left alone they might gather all sorts. Best combined with the system needing recharged for the last 11 month as the engineer could not be bothered to check. And getting much more content replaced but just half an expansion vessel. Now opening indeed can cause something stuck in there. Or the seal just simply sticks over the years. And gets ruptured. But let's face it, it is only a safety device, nothing important.

And how do you need to isolate the boiler for doing so?

The TT indeed is no requirement. But you honestly break into the test nipples and walk away without the feeling to better have checked. Not to talk about it being considered as good practice. Which in return has a legal meaning to you.
If nothing happens, fine. If something happens, you have to answer the question why you did not do it. Last man on the system and no check, tztztz.

 

[hammers4spanner]

leak detector spray over test point as per usual

 

[gassafe]

Quote
And how do you need to isolate the boiler for doing so?

How do you test & top up expansion without isolating the boiler?

 

[gassafe]

Yes the prv is built to reseal... But in the real world. It does not!

the same as a drain off does not open & when it does it leaks everywhere!

A gate valve is designed to shut water off but fails too, same as pump valves!

 

[dancinplumba]

That will teach you to test the prv... Lol

I didn't, it had tripped, exp gone