HRM Wallstar Oil Boiler - Advice please

[Simonvr46]

No problem, respect somebody who knows there limits.

Was the nozzle changed at the last service?

Whereabouts in the country are you?

Will give most things ago but know when I’m at my limits lol.
Yeah nozzle and filters was changed last service.
Im in Lincolnshire.

 

[SimonG]

Too far for me. Hope you find somebody to sort it and please let us know what the problem was.

 

[Simonvr46]

By all means update us if you get a result.

Yeah sure will. Hopefully if I get sorted I’ll be able to pass on my fix to someone else.
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Too far for me. Hope you find somebody to sort it and please let us know what the problem was.

Bacon, sausage and egg butty???

 

[Best]

Fool the photocell into seeing light once burner fires and see if burner continues to fire while photocell out. Handy on Sterling burners.
That will prove flame is poor for some reason or photocell had obstructed view.
Does sound like flame burn is barely making it

 

[Simonvr46]

Fool the photocell into seeing light once burner fires and see if burner continues to fire while photocell out. Handy on Sterling burners.
That will prove flame is poor for some reason or photocell had obstructed view.
Does sound like flame burn is barely making it

Boiler started up 1st attempt this morning.......

I did try this awhile ago. I think when I removed photocell burner continued running but when I covered photocell it shutdown if my memory serves me correctly.
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Took burner unit off and had a look. I’ve attached photos. Tip of nozzle is damp with oil.
Any suggestions?

 

[Best]

Boiler started up 1st attempt this morning...

I did try this awhile ago. I think when I removed photocell burner continued running but when I covered photocell it shutdown if my memory serves me correctly.

Combustion is most likely then poor if flame isn’t partly being obscured from photocell view.
But can have one of many causes.
Nozzle could be faulty, or air setting wrong or burner drawing in flue gases, or oil pump pressure is set wrong, are some possibilities.

 

[SimonG]

Nozzle being damp is fine. Dont like the position of the electrodes though.

 

[Simonvr46]

Nozzle being damp is fine. Dont like the position of the electrodes though.

Just a quick question, the capscrew that is in the main body of the burner just below the black plastic cover for the photo cell etc is that what is undone when boiler serviced? If so should the gasket be replaced?
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could the electrode be causing the issue of lockout? If it’s not positioned correctly could the photocell fail to detect it sometimes?

is the blast tube ok or should that be cleaner?

 

[SJB060685]

The Alan key under the black cover is used to undo and remove the burner, you've detached the whole thing. The electrodes don't look right in terms of position and could be part of the reason it doesn't light sometimes, it doesn't explain why it sometimes ignites and then loses flame during 5 second safety time though.

 

[Simonvr46]

The Alan key under the black cover is used to undo and remove the burner, you've detached the whole thing. The electrodes don't look right in terms of position and could be part of the reason it doesn't light sometimes, it doesn't explain why it sometimes ignites and then loses flame during 5 second safety time though.

That capscrew is seriously tight, should the gasket be replaced when burner is split?

wish id paid more attention to what he was doing when he serviced it.
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I’ve contacted a 3 local heating engineers, 1 said he would go with pump bring issue. 1 said possibly pump but wouldn’t be sure and the other said it’s the control box.

 

[SJB060685]

That capscrew is seriously tight, should the gasket be replaced when burner is split?

wish id paid more attention to what he was doing when he serviced it.
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I’ve contacted a 3 local heating engineers, 1 said he would go with pump bring issue. 1 said possibly pump but wouldn’t be sure and the other said it’s the control box.

When you split the burner any gaskets need to be replaced if not In good reusable condition. I've not experienced on this burner but have on a Riello where the seal had perished causing it to draw more air which was extinguishing the flame like you're experiencing at times.
I did not say for sure it was the pump, only suspicious and I based that on what I've seen heard and read, like I said I cant be sure without checking a couple things. Control box can cause this issue yes and the DKO does things slightly different in lockout mode but again it's hard to say without being there.

 

[Simonvr46]

As far as I’m aware the only parts that have been replaced during service are the filter and the nozzle, no mention of replacing gasket.

should that capscrew be stupidly tight to undo?

with regards to blast tube does that look in good condition?

 

[SJB060685]

Image from manual to show the long bolt you should be removing. Blast tube looked ok, usual wear and tear but overall in acceptable condition. Couldn’t see if there were any obstructions to the cell though

 

[Simonvr46]

View attachment 42435

Image from manual to show the long bolt you should be removing. Blast tube looked ok, usual wear and tear but overall in acceptable condition. Couldn’t see if there were any obstructions to the cell though

Found that image in the HRM handbook. Just didn’t know about how tight that screw should be? Used to screws and bolts having torque setting on them lol.

 

[SJB060685]

These things do quite often have torque settings yes. Alan key below on burner casing looks like the one going by image. Been a while for me on this burner lol

 

[Best]

The large Allen bolt is used for to split the burner (main part from part that also has blast tube and flange on it.
Removing the entire burner is fine if you make sure the seal at flange to boiler is still okay and the bolts are holding burner in firm.
No need to over tighten

 

[Simonvr46]

Found paper work from when it was last serviced, all the last few service record sheets I found all day pump pressure of 120psi even when it was serviced by a different company.

 

[SJB060685]

When was this last record dated? Smoke level fine, CO2 is about right depending on when it was serviced, excess air maybe a little too high. Pump pressure is looking good from my calculations.

 

[Simonvr46]

When was this last record dated? Smoke level fine, CO2 is about right depending on when it was serviced, excess air maybe a little too high. Pump pressure is looking good from my calculations.

That was July 2019 that it was serviced.
How is excess air reduced?

 

[Best]

Looks good readings to me, but I never just assume they are accurate or honest and do my own test results

 

[Best]

That was July 2019 that it was serviced.
How is excess air reduced?

Adjusting the air is for your oil service person to do using an analyser.
I would say excess air is fine. The CO2 reading is good and reducing the air will begin to increase the CO2.
You tried putting your hand partly over air intake and it didn’t help, so leave air settings untouched.

 

[SJB060685]

This needs to be done in conjunction with a FGA (flue gas analyser) and I shouldn’t tell you because randomly adjusting can through all other readings out. Ideally you want maximum combustion and CO2 with no excess air, this however is not practical in the modern world and you will always have a lower CO2 and certain amount of excess air, this is down to the fact increasing CO2 also increases smoke and soot emissions. Again CO2 is set depending on ambient air temperature and density. If excess air was too high it can force heat up through the flue and reduce efficiency, it can also cool the combustion process and increase CO ppm as well as extinguish flame, the data sheet suggests your efficiency and CO are good, certainly for a non condensing boiler.

 

[Simonvr46]

This needs to be done in conjunction with a FGA (flue gas analyser) and I shouldn’t tell you because randomly adjusting can through all other readings out. Ideally you want maximum combustion and CO2 with no excess air, this however is not practical in the modern world and you will always have a lower CO2 and certain amount of excess air, this is down to the fact increasing CO2 also increases smoke and soot emissions. Again CO2 is set depending on ambient air temperature and density. If excess air was too high it can force heat up through the flue and reduce efficiency, it can also cool the combustion process and increase CO ppm as well as extinguish flame, the data sheet suggests your efficiency and CO are good, certainly for a non condensing boiler.

Thanks for that, I’ve no intention of adjusting settings I’ll leave that to experts with correct equipment.
2 Questions

1 - Would the excess air cause the burner to lockout?
2 - Could excess be caused if that gasket hasn’t been replaced?

 

[SJB060685]

Like I said I have known flames to extinguish due to faulty gaskets/seals, however I would expect it to happen constantly if these were a problem.
If there was a problem with gaskets/seals causing an excess of air but not enough to extinguish flame then I would expect to see other readings on my FGA out and the sheet you showed me looked like very good figures (providing they are similar now). I did say the excess air was a bit high yes but only a little to what one usually would see.

 

[Simonvr46]

Like I said I have known flames to extinguish due to faulty gaskets/seals, however I would expect it to happen constantly if these were a problem.
If there was a problem with gaskets/seals causing an excess of air but not enough to extinguish flame then I would expect to see other readings on my FGA out and the sheet you showed me looked like very good figures (providing they are similar now). I did say the excess air was a bit high yes but only a little to what one usually would see.

Figures have been very similar on last few service record sheets, although the 1 from 2016 doesn’t show excess air.
Think I’ll give the electrode gap a check sometime this week.