Not paying for a job

[TripleD]

Hi All,

I'm on the other end of of this stick, I employed a bathroom fitter/plumber to replace my bathroom completely, paid him a £250 deposit.
It took him about a week on and off (on and off as plasterer, electrician, floor fitter was doing work), a week ago last friday he installed the shower screen and setup the shower.
On Saturday we advised of a leak on the floor, he came back Monday to finish other work and re-sealed the bath, Tuesday morning advised the leak was still there, he came back each day Tuesday - Friday and apparently 'fixed' the leak. It leaked over the weekend, so he came back this monday just gone, and made it a whole lot worse, now instead of a small leak I now have a water fall under the bath!

I have refused to pay him any money, and refused entry. He's had 6 chances to rectify the situation, and from what I can see it's not in the realms of bodging it. Silicone is everywhere including grout lines and slurged up the inside of the bath where it meets the wall from underneath.
He wants to be paid for the parts at least, and I'm refusing. From what I can see the tiles have not been correctly put up, the grout is cracked and tiles move.
I can't trust his work, and now face the bill of getting another trades person in to remove the tiles, and I need to order another £250 worth of tiles to do the job properly.

Am I being too harsh not paying him a penny, or am I well within my rights? There was no intention of not paying him, but with all these problems, and the mounting number of finishing issues I feel it's the only way.
I've already been threatened with ripping the pipe work out and small claims court.

I know most people here are going to be plumbers, and I may get crucified, but I'm asking advice as a consumer.

 

[Ray Stafford]

Hi TripleD, and welcome to the forum.

It would be helpful to see some photos, and even if you are not comfortable putting them on the internet, I would recommend taking copious photos anyway.

Without hearing both sides of the argument, its difficult to give an informed answer. For example, if he has supplied £10,000 worth of materials, and you are refusing to pay him a penny, that sounds pretty unreasonable to me.

On the other hand, if, through poor workmanship, he has rendered materials worthless - then he can't expect you to pay for them.

I'd want to see pics, and hear the other side of the story before coming to a conclusion. (Unless the pics were really bad!)

 

[SimonG]

Welcome to the forum

Leaks occur, it's a fact of life. It's how you deal with them that makes the difference.

There are also two sides to a story, not that I'm doubting what you have said.

I would say that half a dozen attempts is more than enough. Very frustrating for yourself. I have had an issue with a particular shower install that I have been back to twice. Customers been very good, but I have booked in with the customer for next week to pull the enclosure and tray and resolve once and for all, at my expense. I want the customer to be happy and have confidence in the install.

I'm afraid that you have somebody at the other end of the spectrum. Was he the cheapest? Did he come recommended? Did you see other works he completed? Did he supply primer, adhesive and grout?

I would think you need to take advice of your rights, as the law changed in October this year to afford more protection to the consumer.

You could post your location for somebody on here to have a look at it for you.

 

[TripleD]

Thanks all.
I supplied all large items, bath, tiles, shower etc.

He supplied Plasterer, pipe work, electrician, grout, adhesives, tile trim, new wooden floor etc. We're not talking vast sums of money, his invoice was for £1400 given the issues with parts and labour, I was initially quoted around £2500.
Electrician billed me directly, there was no issues with his work, his invoice was paid promptly.
Plasterer did an appalling job, came back and offered me £40 refund (I have not paid plasterer that was paid by fitter).
He wasn't the cheapest, and was found on a local forum with recommendations, he lives nearby < 1 mile, I met him, he showed me pictures of his work.

I agree there are two sides to every story, but I'm currently in a position where it's nearly christmas, and with only 1 bathroom in the house I cannot have a shower.

I would much rather a happy person working in my house and doing a good job and pay them a reasonable amount of money then a cheap bodge it person.

I don't want to post pictures. but I have taken copious amounts of pictures and video's of the issues.

 

[SimonG]

Why do you not want to post pictures?

 

[TripleD]

Why do you not want to post pictures?

No other reason than if he becomes difficult I want to have an amoury of pictures whereby he doesn't have time to make up some bad excuses.

 

[ShaunCorbs]

? is he on here then?

 

[Ray Stafford]

No other reason than if he becomes difficult I want to have an amoury of pictures whereby he doesn't have time to make up some bad excuses.

If you end up in court, you will normally have to supply in advance any photos which you want to be admitted as evidence.

I'm not sure what you want from the forum TripleD? If you are looking for an informed judgement, then inform us by sharing the photos. If you just want people to agree with you, post a trite, sentimental quote on facebook!

 

[SimonG]

For the work he has done then its cheap.

Sounds fishy then. If it's poor work then it's poor work. Maybe sounds not as poor as you are making out.

Definitely two sides.

 

[TripleD]

? is he on here then?

No idea.

If you end up in court, you will normally have to supply in advance any photos which you want to be admitted as evidence.

I'm not sure what you want from the forum TripleD? If you are looking for an informed judgement, then inform us by sharing the photos. If you just want people to agree with you, post a trite, sentimental quote on facebook!

Ok, point taken. Like the facebook quote

For the work he has done then its cheap.

Sounds fishy then. If it's poor work then it's poor work. Maybe sounds not as poor as you are making out.

Definitely two sides.

I think the £1400 represents that I'm not happy with the work.

Pictures and video's uploading soon then....

 

[TripleD]

Okay, forum says I'm unable to post URL's?

Try this with the usual in front: 1drv.ms/1OiT4DI

 

[Ray Stafford]

That link in full

 

[Ray Stafford]

Quite a lot of silicon around!

 

[rocketmanbkk]

The shower tray & enclosure don't look new

 

[rocketmanbkk]

In pic 2 bottom left it looks like old scale/leak discolour. Pic 2 top right ish looks like the chrome enclosure isn't new.

 

[rocketmanbkk]

There is a lot of silicone but imo £1400 isn't a lot of money. He's spent half that in silicone ! Only joking

Back to the point, the tray & enclosure aren't new.

What the plumber saying then?

 

[ShaunCorbs]

Look at that flexi it's bent 90 right on the fitting

 

[rocketmanbkk]

Hi All,

I'm on the other end of of this stick, I employed a bathroom fitter/plumber to replace my bathroom completely, paid him a £250 deposit.
It took him about a week on and off (on and off as plasterer, electrician, floor fitter was doing work), a week ago last friday he installed the shower screen and setup the shower.
On Saturday we advised of a leak on the floor, he came back Monday to finish other work and re-sealed the bath, Tuesday morning advised the leak was still there, he came back each day Tuesday - Friday and apparently 'fixed' the leak. It leaked over the weekend, so he came back this monday just gone, and made it a whole lot worse, now instead of a small leak I now have a water fall under the bath!

I have refused to pay him any money, and refused entry. He's had 6 chances to rectify the situation, and from what I can see it's not in the realms of bodging it. Silicone is everywhere including grout lines and slurged up the inside of the bath where it meets the wall from underneath.
He wants to be paid for the parts at least, and I'm refusing. From what I can see the tiles have not been correctly put up, the grout is cracked and tiles move.
I can't trust his work, and now face the bill of getting another trades person in to remove the tiles, and I need to order another £250 worth of tiles to do the job properly.

Am I being too harsh not paying him a penny, or am I well within my rights? There was no intention of not paying him, but with all these problems, and the mounting number of finishing issues I feel it's the only way.
I've already been threatened with ripping the pipe work out and small claims court.

I know most people here are going to be plumbers, and I may get crucified, but I'm asking advice as a consumer.

You say you can't trust his work, tiles & grout no good etc.

Why didn't you approach him when you noticed it? Don't say you didn't look before he finished as I know that when a tradesman leaves a property for the day customers go & have a good old look at what's going on, I know I do.

Why won't you pay for materials?

Are you disputing his materials as well as his labour charge?

 

[TripleD]

There is a lot of silicone but imo £1400 isn't a lot of money. He's spent half that in silicone ! Only joking

Back to the point, the tray & enclosure aren't new.

What the plumber saying then?

All was brand new and unpacked when they started on the 7th Dec.

Plumber wants paying for materials, or to come back for a 7th time to fix the leak.

 

[rocketmanbkk]

The op supplied larger items - as I said to me from the pics supplied they don't look new.

But saying that the chap took the work on.

It's seems a case of you vs him

Tell us what he's saying about your disputes

Have you pointed out specifically what you're not happy with?

List them here.

 

[rocketmanbkk]

All was brand new and unpacked when they started on the 7th Dec.

Plumber wants paying for materials, or to come back for a 7th time to fix the leak.

How do you explain the rusty colour stain on the bottom left of pic 2. That's a stain that won't occur overnight.

 

[TripleD]

You say you can't trust his work, tiles & grout no good etc.

Why didn't you approach him when you noticed it? Don't say you didn't look before he finished as I know that when a tradesman leaves a property for the day customers go & have a good old look at what's going on, I know I do.

Why won't you pay for materials?

Are you disputing his materials as well as his labour charge?

I looked around and noticed bits that I mentioned like tile trim mitre, leak etc.

I'm disputing paying anything as the job has not been completed, and is substandard.
As been mentioned, the flexi pipe being bent is something more recent as we have been going through checking.
Why should I pay parts or anything?

With grout cracked and tiles wobbling, I paid for the tiles so I now need to pay again for more tiles, so my parts costs are going up. Why should I be out of pocket?

 

[rocketmanbkk]

I looked around and noticed bits that I mentioned like tile trim mitre, leak etc.

I'm disputing paying anything as the job has not been completed, and is substandard.
As been mentioned, the flexi pipe being bent is something more recent as we have been going through checking.
Why should I pay parts or anything?

With grout cracked and tiles wobbling, I paid for the tiles so I now need to pay again for more tiles, so my parts costs are going up. Why should I be out of pocket?

Don't have a pop at me pal. You're here for advice. If you don't like what you hear then don't ask.

Bye

 

[TripleD]

How do you explain the rusty colour stain on the bottom left of pic 2. That's a stain that won't occur overnight.

From the plastering? He fitted bath, and tiled wall before plasterer came in.

 

[rocketmanbkk]

No more interest from me

Maybe others will have

Take him to court

What else do you want to hear?

Pay a chartered surveyor to calculate the jobs worth. Spend good money after bad.

Seems your the type