The Green Deal

[hammers4spanner]

from what i gather if you do both eco and GD then its over 10 grands worth of paperwork hassle , i am not sure what the rates are direct from the energy companies tho

 

[JAH HEATING]

One man band outfits are just getting killed to bits with this

 

[julesverne]

As said, there's Subbie work out there. But be careful who you work for.

thats not what i asked i want to know what funding is given for a straight swap combi etc before the money is cut up and trickles down to midddlemen etc.

why would i want to do subbie work. defeats the whole object of being self employed. i ain't lining the pocket of some middle man and taking all the responsibility for a few hundred quid. would rather go work for BG

 

[julesverne]

from what i gather if you do both eco and GD then its over 10 grands worth of paperwork hassle , i am not sure what the rates are direct from the energy companies tho

i honestly think thats Chinese whispers.

you can get pas 2030 software for £300.00 plus VAT just need a agreeable missus or someone willing to do the paperwork. thats why i think we should get together as a collective and cut all the rest out.

 

[hammers4spanner]

One man band outfits are just getting killed to bits with this

thats exactly what they said down plumb center today , they said since this has properly started kicking off that one man bands work has died a death .

not thought through at all this scheme

 

[hammers4spanner]

i honestly think thats Chinese whispers.

you can get pas 2030 software for £300.00 plus VAT just need a agreeable missus or someone willing to do the paperwork. thats why i think we should get together as a collective and cut all the rest out.

i know about 5 local firms that have done this now one of them gave me a break down of costs all said same thing .on paper apparently when you start this off you think its a few hundred quid but beforew you know it your upto your neck in it

 

[JAH HEATING]

thats exactly what they said down plumb center today , they said since this has properly started kicking off that one man bands work has died a death .

not thought through at all this scheme

i did my first boiler swap in ages on tuesday

got a conversion to do on the horizon, had no enquires at all over boiler chchanges landlords who have used me for a few years hardly ring these days, it's on it's arse this game big time if you work for yourself

 

[julesverne]

it is tough at the moment but then i do a lot bathroom refurb's and plumbing so i don't feel it as hard if i was just doing Gas i think the story may be different. but dont forget though eco funding only goes to people on benefits and pensions. so there's whole lot of others out there that need boilers . finding them that's the hard part.

i also find april to july is utter pants for getting boilers swaps cust are more interested in holidays.

 

[hammers4spanner]

The obscure thing about this scheme is that a neighbour just down the road from me asked me to quote her central heating system for her which i done . She was happy with price and looked into ways to afford to do the works like a loan however she stumbled across the green deal .
Now she asked me about it whichy i told her however i cant fit her heating under green deal so now shes asking the question am i qualified to do central heating??

so in a nutshell this green deal is utterly stupid

 

[gassafe]

Seems crazy the government are trying to stimulate growth & employment etc, then bring in the green screw you over deal, which takes a huge chunk of work away from many firms / self employed and only benefits the likes of British gas & big players...

I heard the scheme is initiated & funded by the big energy companies, so its them who want the install work generated... It's there way of getting rid of the little guys, because they cannot compete on price, but we can't compete on bull@@t like pas2030... I don't know what that is, and don't really care. All I know is I don't want it!

i hope they scrap the whole thing, a boiler scrap page type scheme would be more welcome, and easier for customer & installers alike...

 

[jase158]

I thought it was only for solar, oh well, will take a look through all posts and research this as may be good to offer to customers!!

 

[tamz]

Seems crazy the government are trying to stimulate growth & employment etc, then bring in the green screw you over deal, which takes a huge chunk of work away from many firms / self employed and only benefits the likes of British gas & big players...

I heard the scheme is initiated & funded by the big energy companies, so its them who want the install work generated... It's there way of getting rid of the little guys, because they cannot compete on price, but we can't compete on bull@@t like pas2030... I don't know what that is, and don't really care. All I know is I don't want it!

i hope they scrap the whole thing, a boiler scrap page type scheme would be more welcome, and easier for customer & installers alike...

This is the way of things to come.
If you do heating you will have to jump onto this or be left behind. The green deal itself is shyt. The usual government ill thought out idea from people who couldn't spell shift!
Nobody wants it and there has been no work done under the green deal (no matter how much they hype it) and according to an interview on radio 4 last week, out of 38,000 assesments there is a grand sum of 4 people who are signed up but no work has yet been done. BBC News - Only four people sign up for flagship Green Deal
All the work is being done through the ECO gold rush (paid for byus on our bills) but unfortunately you are unlikely (unless you want to go the whole hog) to get much of a rush out of it as you will be subbing for bottom dollar.
This will affect everyone in the trade. You either jump on and work for 1990 prices or your work will rapidly dry up and you will have to change.
Up until about March i was doing at least boiler a week but most times 2 a week. I've done 7 since then.
I had a call on Monday for a repair on a boiler (it needed an APS). Before i had the case back on, i was handed the phone from the daughter of the guy, who told me not to fix it because her dad could get a new boiler for nothing through ECO. I couldn't argue as he probably would but was then left with the how much do i charge for my waste of time. Just give me 20 quid for turning up.
This is the biggest game changer ever to hit the heating game. I can't really be ar$ed competing in it but i am still booked in for the pas 2030 shyt training (about on par with how to pysh in a tank) so i can keep in the game but i am changing direction and moving into different things.
The heating game is fkd for the small guy. If it is not the manu's cutting your grass it is the government.

 

[eaton]

I'd be charging full rate for call out, sod it, if your getting nothing more from them, get as much as you can now

 

[Dickie]

What tamz has stated is very true & his posts are always worth a read if you want a real insight into how our trade works.

Some other details on the ECO scheme, limited or no work is done to the existing radiators or central heating system, it's not covered by the scheme. Many companies are not cleaning systems correctly, so long term it's not good for the new boilers.
Yes it's a free boiler but nothing else.

As I've stated, there's subbie work out there, but be selective & realistic. Also as the scheme goes on the cowboys will be found out & the cream will rise to the top.

 

[theanalyst]

PAS2030 is for green deal installers though....???

PAS 2030 Installer Accreditation | Green Deal Installer

Is that needed for the ECO scheme then?

 

[hammers4spanner]

yes think it is , i enquired about eco and sounded very much same as green deal but without the bells

 

[diamondgas]

I hate this idea! It'll kill off a lot of small businesses who rely on doing the 'crap' jobs big business usually turn away from! I hope and pray that the legitimate small businesses working about can be gifted enough work to weather the storm!! had a landlord customer call me wanting me to replace a boiler under ECO! Alas, I said, all I can offer is a check after install and maybe a magna to protect the system after install! Least I get something out of it and maybe the CP12 next year? ECO potentially is going to cripple the small businesses in this industry that rely on the servicing the Shylark Landlords out there!!

 

[hammers4spanner]

I hate this idea! It'll kill off a lot of small businesses who rely on doing the 'crap' jobs big business usually turn away from! I hope and pray that the legitimate small businesses working about can be gifted enough work to weather the storm!! had a landlord customer call me wanting me to replace a boiler under ECO! Alas, I said, all I can offer is a check after install and maybe a magna to protect the system after install! Least I get something out of it and maybe the CP12 next year? ECO potentially is going to cripple the small businesses in this industry that rely on the servicing the Shylark Landlords out there!!

I totally agree this is probably been arranged to kill off one man bands from the heating game they cant compete with pricing of the one man band so in one hit its pretty much sqyueezed us out of business.
I mentiond in an earlier post about how i priced a heat pack and cant do it if it goes through green deal .Its basically saying you are not able to do your job even tho you have all the quals other than the pas 2030 at £5000

The trump card tho is exactly as you say after install inspection where you rip it to bits and riddor it as you can guarantee their will be a high volume of shocking installs left with allsorts of issues

 

[Dickie]

As said several times, why not do subbie work. Be selective & ensure you get paid.
Of course if you're a course cowboy & spend half your day with your nose in a book or your course notes, you'll be too slow to make any money doing subbie work.

I know plenty guys that are only on the GSR, van & tools & are making a very good living. So don't have a wishbone, get a backbone, get our there & find the work.

 

[hammers4spanner]

As said several times, why not do subbie work. Be selective & ensure you get paid.
Of course if you're a course cowboy & spend half your day with your nose in a book or your course notes, you'll be too slow to make any money doing subbie work.

I know plenty guys that are only on the GSR, van & tools & are making a very good living. So don't have a wishbone, get a backbone, get our there & find the work.

as i have said the rates down here for it are crap

 

[gassafe]

As said several times, why not do subbie work. Be selective & ensure you get paid.
Of course if you're a course cowboy & spend half your day with your nose in a book or your course notes, you'll be too slow to make any money doing subbie work.

I know plenty guys that are only on the GSR, van & tools & are making a very good living. So don't have a wishbone, get a backbone, get our there & find the work.

I didn't go self employed to be busting a gut for some crappy day rate to make some big national company plenty of money! I may as well go stack shelves.

 

[JAH HEATING]

The firm I was going to subbie for has said the work may not be there now due to the crap prices, he said the funding has been capped now an the likes of bg have swallowed up a lot of the work

 

[gassafe]

I emailed an energy firm last night put of interest on the Eco scheme, they said they wanted installers for boilers! They replied that they were owned by another energy firm and were selling leads to already registered Eco qualified installers!

What a joke, who wants to jump through hoops to get Eco registered, to then have to buy leads off a middle man company... Sounds like everyone is trying to get there slice, and the end installer who does all the work & takes all the responsibility gets the smallest reward at the end of it it seems!

 

[Dickie]

I didn't go self employed to be busting a gut for some crappy day rate to make some big national company plenty of money! I may as well go stack shelves.

I completely understand your views mate, but being self employed is no walk in the park and for most course cowboys it's the only route they can go down. I don't know your background so I'm not inferring you're a CC.

I know of guys that are getting £130 per combi swop, finished by 2.00pm & out fixing boilers or doing CP12s for the remained of the day.

Of course I don't advocate the methods some companies use on the ECO scheme, many of which are just con men. But they're no more con men then the rest of the ex-used car salesmen that are selling Green products. How many out there have sold & installed boilers & appliances on the back of the RHI & Feed in tariffs that never materialised??? So people that live in greenhouses etc!!! There's a certain irony in the word 'Greenhouse'.....LOL!!!

 

[hammers4spanner]

well thats your issue right their '£130' combi swap

devalued trade