Advice on heating in a new build property

[slacky]

Hey guys

looking for abit of advice on my heating system in a house I’ve just moved into. Last week I had to bleed a few radiators which I thought was normal but today I’ve had to go round bleeding them again and there was quite abit of air in them. How often should they need to be bleed? The down stairs toilet needed bleeding first time round but now it’s stone cold but doesnt need bleeding. What could be wrong with this? Also a few radiators are hot to touch but if I put my hand over the top it doesn’t feel like much heats coming off them and lastly for a new build property it’s costing anything from £4-6a day for gas and the heatings only on a few hours a day but doesn’t seem to reach temperature. For a new build property it seems abit excessive my old house was built In 1960ish and didn’t cost this much to run.

any help would be appreciated

thanks

 

[townfanjon]

Sorry this sounds like a typical new build , probably only teething problems but get yourself around the site office , assuming they are still there.

 

[slacky]

They do have after care but I was hoping it’ll be things I could sort out myself. I’ve done a 2 page snag list that Im still waiting for them to start. The heatings been on for 2 hours and the temperatures gone up from 16 to 18 degrees. Not sure if I’m expecting to much but I used to live in a relatively new house 7 years ago I’m sure I used to walk round in shorts it was that hot this time of year

 

[king of pipes]

Any pictures of the install ? do you have weather compensation fitted to the system ? Probably just needs a few tweaks here and there get the installers back its their responsibility to get it working properly. Kop

 

[slacky]

It’s a ideal logic heat 15 with a tribune xe tank. It’s got 2 zones for heating a stat on the 2nd floor for 1st and 2nd then a stat on the ground floor for just the ground floor. As far as im aware it hasn’t got any weather compensation

 

[Stu-B]

It is rather cold at the moment, plus your house is a brand new build I’d guess it’s been empty without the heating on for a bit too, you need to let the fabric of the house warm up, you know like walls floors kitchen units etc, then the house will start to feel warm. Is the temp dial on the front of the boiler at 65degrees and the rads getting piping hot to touch?
As for bleeding, the system will have been thrown in by a subby on a price, probably over worked and the install price as low as the builder can get away with, it’ll take a while to settle and all the air to work it’s way to the top of the system, keep bleeding the rads but don’t forget to top up the pressure, you’ll find the filing loop and gauge in the cylinder cupboard. Let us know how you get on.

 

[Scott_D]

Have you checked the system pressure?
Is the hot water cylinder on the top floor?

 

[Brambles]

Slacky,

From the information that you have given, it would indicate that the boiler is working very hard, but not achieving the set room temperatures.

First, check that your meter readings and cost calculation is correct - take readings direct from the meter at the same time each day. Don’t rely on the information from a portable Smart Meter device.

If your calculation of £4 to £6 of gas / day is correct (which I would doubt):

As an order of magnitude, assuming an average gas cost of 3.5p /KW, £4/day represents your boiler (12kw) on 80% load for 12 hours. That would possibly be caused either by too low a flow temperature set at the boiler or a boiler that is significantly undersized for the system it is powering. However, you are not saying that the boiler is on continuously - which it would need to be tconsume that volume of gas.

With your handover pack there should be a Bench Mark Certificate completed and signed by the installer. If the Builder/Developer is slow to respond contact the installer direct. Most installers are very responsive to address issues on systems that they have signed off. If you don’t have a Benchmark Certificate demand one - you will need it for the boiler warranty.

Under the Central Heating section, The Benchmark certificate will show you the boiler flow temperature - measure it at the hottest pipe leaving the boiler and see if it matches the recorded reading. It should be around 70 degrees with a return temperature below 55 degrees.

The issues with air and system pressure have been covered by other posters. However, with the system you have described - when set up correctly, you should get all radiators hot to the touch whilst the house gets up to temperature. If you don’t it (the heating system ) needs to be recommissioned and balanced.

Finally, talk to your new neighbours and see what issues they are experiencing with their heating system (if any).

If the builder and installer remain unresponsive, put them on notice that if they don’t address the issue properly, you will engage a third party and back charge them.

Hope the above helps.

 

[slacky]

I’ll be ringing the site Foreman in the Morning to see if anything can be sorted. I just either wanted to sort the little problems out myself rather than have the inconvenience of waiting in for half the day and for them to try fob my partner off because they want to get back to their price work or have an idea of what’s wrong so I know what they should be looking at. I’ve been in the house for 2 weeks now and the heatings was on constant for 2-4 weeks before I moved in not sure how longs things take to heat up. I’ve also noticed the stat downstairs doesn’t go above 18 degreees and I get a low heating warning on the stat because it’s took longer than 2 hours to get to 20 degrees
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Sorry for the double post I didn’t refresh the page before I typed my reply 🙈 I’ve got a commission certificate at home I’ll get it out when I get back. The boilers on highest temperature setting I’ve already checked that. I did too the pressure up to 1.5 bar after I bleed the radiators yesterday. Most of the radiators are piping hot to touch but doesn’t seem much coming out the top of them

 

[Brambles]

The downstairs thermostat sounds like it is a Danfos TP One which has been set by the builder with Temperature Limitation at 18 degrees C, whilst the property dries out. That is common practice by some Developers.

Having said that, it does not explain the symptoms you described in your earlier post - but the information on your Benchmark Certificate will indicate exactly how the boiler has been set up / configured.

If your rads are all piping hot and you are not achieving 20 degrees C - that is starting to point to a system that is undersized

 

[slacky]

Just checked the boiler and it’s set to 80 degreees is this to high?
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Just checked the benchmark it says central heating flow rate 80 degrees and return rate 65 degreees.
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Just checked the stat on the ground floor under installer settings temperature limitations and it’s 5 degreees to 35 degrees is that the section you mean ?

 

[king of pipes]

Yes thats a bit high a modern new build property should not require the boiler to be set that high, i would still contact the developers and get their installers to check the operation of heating and its controls . Kop

 

[slacky]

There’s a e on the dial I presume that means efficiency? I’ve turned it onto the e to see if that helps which takes it down to 65 degrees

 

[Scott_D]

Is there a TRV on the radiator in the room with the room thermostat

 

[garygvl]

e is the eco setting to keep the return temp at optimum so boiler stays in condensing mode as much as possible
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can see this turning into another pointless warranty call to ideal as more than likely site will say its under warranty get the manufacturers out

 

[Brambles]

If you have a flow temperature of 80 degrees and the rads are all getting hot, then that is the best you are going to get for heat in your property as currently installed and insulated. It us unlikely that there is anything wrong with the boiler.

If you want the boiler to operate more efficiently as a condensing boiler the flow temp needs to be reduced to give a return temp of less than 55 degrees C.

The temperature restriction on the Danfos TP1 can be removed by the parameters on menu 3 or 4 on installer settings

 

[slacky]

There isn’t a trv on the radiator on the ground floor in the hallway where the ground floor stat is but in the top bedroom where the second stat is there’s trvs on both radiators but no trv just outside the room on the landing outside

I just know when the plumber comes round he’ll just try fob us off with the usual crap. I’ve had them round a couple of times for leaks and you can tell they don’t want to be here

 

[garygvl]

when you turn off all your programmers, hot water and both heating stats, does the display on the boiler go to 00

 

[king of pipes]

There’s a e on the dial I presume that means efficiency? I’ve turned it onto the e to see if that helps which takes it down to 65 degrees

Just for the record how many rads do you have ?

 

[garygvl]

There isn’t a trv on the radiator on the ground floor in the hallway where the ground floor stat is but in the top bedroom where the second stat is there’s trvs on both radiators but no trv just outside the room on the landing outside

I just know when the plumber comes round he’ll just try fob us off with the usual crap. I’ve had them round a couple of times for leaks and you can tell they don’t want to be here

shouldn't be trvs on both rads in bedroom where second stat is

 

[slacky]

Yes the boiler goes to 00 and there’s 16 radiators in the whole house. I’ve been round and added up all the kw for the size and type of radiators and it comes to 8.7kw so we’ll in the boiler capacity
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Sorry my mistake on both radiators on the top floor where the stat is there isn’t any trvs on them

 

[Scott_D]

Have you checked the heating system pressure?

 

[king of pipes]

Hmmmm i would say your boiler is undersized 16 rads and a Tribune cylinder is alot for a 15kw ideal i was expecting around 8- 10 rads max

 

[garygvl]

Hmmmm i would say your boiler is undersized 16 rads and a Tribune cylinder is alot for a 15kw ideal i was expecting around 8- 10 rads max

Yes the boiler goes to 00 and there’s 16 radiators in the whole house. I’ve been round and added up all the kw for the size and type of radiators and it comes to 8.7kw so we’ll in the boiler capacity
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Sorry my mistake on both radiators on the top floor where the stat is there isn’t any trvs on them

are you on 3 floors with boiler on ground floor and cylinder on top floor

 

[slacky]

are you on 3 floors with boiler on ground floor and cylinder on top floor

Yes the cylinder on the top floor just outside the bedroom