ARCHOVED Magic Heating Box - Magic Thermodynamics Box

[AmritPedersen]

Magic Heating Box - Magic Thermodynamics Box

Stan is spot on you can have the best heating system in the world but if the house is not thermally efficient then nothing is going to work

Perhaps I'm just being picky, but you can't have the best heating system without the house being thermally efficient. And chuck in some mechanical ventilation with heat recovery, too.

 

[Tim Cremin]

Magic Heating Box - Magic Thermodynamics Box

Hi my name is Tim Cremin and I am a plumber with 28 years’experience. I invented the Heating Box over 12 years ago and since then I have constantly developed this product. This product was invented by me a plumber for plumbers. My motivation for inventing the Heating Box was that over the years I was aware of the common problems associated with central heating systems i.e. poorly operating heating systems, not all the radiators heating on the zone, having to balance some radiators to try and get others to heat(which is basically closing down a radiator that is heating well to reduce its output to try and get the other radiators in the zone to heat). Common sense will tell you this is all wrong. There is no set process tobalance a heating system, it is trial and error, and if it worked correctly all radiator valves should be open fully to allow all radiators to heat evenly and this is impossible with a typical central heating system. We all know that plumbers are often blamed for a central heating system that does not operate correctly. This is totally unjust, as the plumber is just given a boiler, a number of radiators, pipe and fittings etc. and told to go out and put them together. His skills are limited by the individual components themselves and how they perform when combined into a system. I realised that what was missing was a process to combine all the different plumbing principles of these components together, and that is where I came up with the idea toinvent the Heating Box. The product gives the plumber a single centre point to work from. So you can see the Heating Box is basically designed “by a Plumber for a Plumber”. Now the heating engineer can do his job in confidence and put a stop to the unfair accusations that are oftenunjustifiably directed towards Plumbers.The features of my invention as follows: The unique and successful way that the Heating Box incorporates different plumbing principles into one unit won it the Silver Medal at the International inventions fair held in Geneva.It has undergone extensive independent testing by Fluid &Heat Transfer Professors at Trinity College Dublin whose findings confirmed theHeating Box brings unique benefits to a central heating system.The product was awarded a patent because the principles ofthe product are totally unique in the market place. Please do not confuse this product with a low loss header nor a buffer vessel as the process is different. As a plumber I considered all these products before I was then compelled to go off and invent the Heating Box, as alone those products did not successfully do what I needed them to. In the Heating Box the heat exchange for the radiators now takes place inside the box at greater efficiency such that it allows you to reduce the operating temperature of your boiler. The Heating Box also has a TUV certification who approves and over sees the design, quality and manufacturing process. Their standards are world leading. The benefits of my invention as follows: It provides energy savings for the home owner. It also allows for greater comfort levels in the home and because more area of the radiator is utilised more energy is realised into the room. It allows a condensing boiler to condense for longer allowing for greater efficiency. In conclusion this product has been installed domestically with great success. I am not the type of individual who knocks any other product on the market place. I believe in my own product and what it can achieve. I can say this honestly. It also has been independently tested and this process continues even today, as I develop this and other products even further. I never get involved in blogging but I felt that on this occasion I had to as it was brought to my attention that false claims were being made against it. Ultimately I take these personally as I am the inventor of the product and have developed it with much passion over the last decade. I have never met a person called Tom Bishop who has claimed he met me at a training session in Italy. Unfortunately sites like this allow for faceless people with negative comments to prosper for their own hidden agendas. It also allows for faceless people to make demeaning comments on my race as being Irish. All I have always offered is my time, my knowledge and my experience. I sure that these persons are in the minority, as the vast majority of persons who use this site come from a plumbing back round like myself. I won’t be replying to any other blogs on this site but I felt that on this occasion I had to. Tim Cremin

 

[erpkid]

Magic Heating Box - Magic Thermodynamics Box

The happy and knowledgeable customers in this video have convinced me to promote this product to all the pensioners in my area.

Magic Heating Box - Customers Opinion | Central Heating Management System - YouTube

Spot on Keefy......all things cured by a powerflush. Although if the system was sludged due to poor layout then this additional box of nowt won't stop it happening again.

 

[Elbow]

Magic Heating Box - Magic Thermodynamics Box

"I won’t be replying to any other blogs on this site but I felt that on this occasion I had to."

So you don't want to get involved in a discussion, then? Just join the forum, make one post defending your "invention", and then not post again?

 

[Gray0689]

Magic Heating Box - Magic Thermodynamics Box

Where so we see the data on your product Tim

 

[Killy Bing]

Magic Heating Box - Magic Thermodynamics Box

Now now lets hear the poor man out! I can easily get to essex, as can probably a couple of dozen other engineers on here.

we will happily come for a training day and you can explain to use how exactly it works, show us your figures and research into it and how you obtain the savings and increased efficiency.

 

[Rickster123]

Magic Heating Box - Magic Thermodynamics Box

I'd be up for a free training day tim! How bout it?

 

[Keefy]

Magic Heating Box - Magic Thermodynamics Box

Tim, Tim Tim Tim Tim Tim... a few questions if you've be so kind as to answer them:

1. Joshua Parker, do you know him and does he have a financial interest in your product?
2. What is the correct name for this box of yours; 'Magic Box' or 'Heating Box'?

Thank you,

Keefy

 

[Keefy]

Magic Heating Box - Magic Thermodynamics Box

I can't find these demeaning comments on his 'race as being Irish' he talks of:

I may have missed them, anyone else see them?

Edit: Forgot to ask, which boiler manufacturers approve of your product?

 

[SimonG]

Magic Heating Box - Magic Thermodynamics Box

Let's see some hard tangible facts on this physics busting device. I've seen a lot of requests for the 'facts' from regular trusted posters on this box. Give us numbers.

 

[AmritPedersen]

Magic Heating Box - Magic Thermodynamics Box

There's a lot of comment out there about this product. If Tim will invite 1king55 and some others to a training day & proves his product then he'll get a lot of positive publicity. I guess if he doesn't invite them, we'll just have to draw our own conclusions on the validity or otherwise of his claims.

Now now lets hear the poor man out! I can easily get to essex, as can probably a couple of dozen other engineers on here.

we will happily come for a training day and you can explain to use how exactly it works, show us your figures and research into it and how you obtain the savings and increased efficiency.

by the way guys, who wants to be picked up in my tardis?

 

[Killy Bing]

Magic Heating Box - Magic Thermodynamics Box

I am more than happy to go, finally have some use for those physics a levels i did.

 

[galaxy_plumbing]

Magic Heating Box - Magic Thermodynamics Box

very amusing here, haha

 

[Gray0689]

Magic Heating Box - Magic Thermodynamics Box

For a man to come on and say how passionate
He is about his product and then not bother answering any of the questions on its performance data makes me and I am sure as you can see a lot of other people very sceptical indeed
We welcome your input Tim
Ps no where in this thread has it been mentioned about your Irish nationality!!

 

[Jimbob]

Magic Heating Box - Magic Thermodynamics Box

How much they trying to sell to you for

I think around £3000 from memory. Went by the name of magic box and did HW only, also quoted me a crazy COP. As I work with ASHPs and TD systems etc I just couldn't see how it would pay. Not something I'd want to associate with

 

[peteheat]

Magic Heating Box - Magic Thermodynamics Box

Rule 1) Never put anything on the internet that is not 100% true and accurate, Here

In 2006 the Oxyvent or Cremin tank was retailing around €630.00 by June 2012 the price had a respectable increase to €800.00 including VAT Here

The tank was evaluated by Trinity College :

Not my research so I can't confirm but maybe Tim can as it is his baby:

"What is most important here is that, over time, the average power output, that being the thermal energy dissipated by Rad #6 into the room, is about the same with a small 8.8 % measured drop. However, this 8.8% is within the experimental uncertainty of the measurement system and is likely not significant. In reality, the tighter power control of the Oxyvent system would provide exceptionally improved comfort since it would maintain the temperature of a room at a much more steady temperature compared with the balanced system."

Basically it says nothing as the 8.8% is within the experimental uncertainty.

If you are really interested my source for most of the above is available on a site called Web Archive use your friend Google to take you there the site name is oxyvent.com

Another historic link about the Oxyvent Here not much but you get an idea.

The product has a patent which can be viewed with the associated drawings Here

I met Tim a long time ago He seemed to be a genuine type, a real plumber who devised a way to remove air / oxygen from heating systems, he spent a lot of money trying to market the benefits of his product and as I remember the TV show the link above refers to he did refuse the venture capitalists offer of a large sum because they wanted a major share of the business. (A bit like an old version of Dragons Den.)

I did offer to fit a working version of the Oxyvent in my showroom but heard no more, (Tim I never throw away computers so if needed I can prove the offer was made).

Without meaning offense to the innocent, some of the best sales men I have ever encountered are English, you all know the type, flash suits, shoes that cost a months pay, (aluminum windows pay for themselves in a year) full of confidence and boy can they dodge the important questions in a way that makes you feel like a fool for asking in the first place.

Having viewed the "Magic" web sites I believe that a few specialist salesmen have taken hold of both the Oxyvent and the Thermodynamic Solar ideas and are using them as tools to charge outlandish prices for systems that can not perform as claimed, they are dressed up to be the latest and greatest answers to the increased fuel costs by claiming to maintain the "Targets" home at a comfortable level and saving them money in the process.

For example I do know the panels are Never supposed to fitted as in this video (I downloaded it just in case they remove it from You Tube) Here

So why make a video of an incorrect installation?

Because it makes the system appear to be "All things to all men" or they can take your money regardless of how difficult or even impossible the installation appears, they will not disappoint you by refusing your money.

I have answered their spam emails with a few questions, I wonder why I never get a reply?

Caveat Emptor.

 

[Millsy 82]

Magic Heating Box - Magic Thermodynamics Box

"Joshua" - Why are the comments on your YouTube video disabled? I find people normally do this to avoid the public seeing negative comments.

Magic Heating Box - Oil Installation | Central Heating Management System - YouTube

Ummmmm I think that might of been my fault Lol. I may have explained to them that the product overcomes a problem that does not exist in a correctly installed/ sized system and asked them to explain how the magic box differs from a low loss header and upgrading the controls.

Sorry for spoiling everybodies fun on youtube.

 

[rodders]

Magic Heating Box - Magic Thermodynamics Box

That was an interesting read..!

 

[Renewablesoluti]

Magic Heating Box - Magic Thermodynamics Box

Hello everbody,

i'm also new in this forum, actually i was just looking for some other opinions for this technic. I allready have spent a lot of time with this products. Please read this and write your opinion, how true it is what they claim. I'm sorry for my english, I'm a german installer and bought it from the "exclusive" distributor in germany.

First of all, please be aware that they are offering mainly two products:

1. Magic Thermodynamic Box
2. Magic Heating Box

Even if the names are a little bit confusing, the description from the company for the products are very differnt.

Please be aware that I ONLY saw the Magic Thermodynamic Box working, everything over the Magic Heating Box is just what the manufacturer claims:

1. Magic Thermodynamic Box:

Uses thermodynamic technology to heat up water to 55 degrees. I was really skeptical first, and installed one of these sytems (the prices which you mentioned here are way over that what i bought the matieral for). In fact, what I got delivered was one thermodynamic panel and one Thermodynamic Box. After the installation which I did together with my F Gas partner (not actually F Gas, in germany its called a little bit different) my aim was to collect as much datas as I could. The time for the installation was nearly 2 days, but we also had some time wasted cause it was our first installation and we did it without guide. When we finished the magic box was infact heating water, but much slower than what was promoted. I colelcted datas (also electricity used) to calculate and check the numbers which they claimed. I wrote everything together and wrote to the manufacturer (this is NOT the company in Chelmsford, they are build in Spain, the brand is sitting in Chelmsford). I got a really good support from them, telling me what could be the case for the low performance, in fact for a tank of my size, they recommend 2 thermodynamic panels. one panel is good for tanks up to 150 liters. I'm awating now my delivery of the next panel, more informations to come. If my english was to bad im really sorry, if something is unclear or you can not understand it please write and i try to provide it.

2. Magic Heating Box (NO EXPERIENCE JUST INFOS FROM THE MANUFACTURER)

The claim to raise the speed of the water through the boilers by 70%, also taking the air out of the system constantly. THey claim that this leas to better heated radiators and that afterwards you be able to reduce the temperature of the heating system.
Can not commend if that is true or not, just how this product should work.


Looking forward to your answers.

 

[peteheat]

Magic Heating Box - Magic Thermodynamics Box

Is This Post any help to you?

 

[Renewablesoluti]

Magic Heating Box - Magic Thermodynamics Box

Yes, that post exactly describes the Magic Heating Box, even I have never seen that working. The german distributor showed me that one as well, but he said he is testing this himself at the moment, to see if it works. Only difference between the picture there and the one which he showed me where some stickers for marketing.

Was this box working back then?

Also, I can not see where this price of £13.000 pounds came from.

The Magic Thermodynamic Box was to me as an installer under €2000, which is in pounds £1700 currently. On top on that is then the next panel which I ordered, to see if the Magic Thermodynamic hits the figures, also they sended me some test certificates about the power output of the Magic Thermodynamic Box.

Maybe the prices in the UK are so high cause there is not much competition yet?

Do you know how the panels are designed to install? Just trying to see how much hot water I can get out off it under best conditions.

 

[Elbow]

Re: Magic Heating Box - Magic Thermodynamics Box

The "30% to 50% fuel saving" claim seems to have suddenly disappeared from the makers' website.

 

[Deleted member 2053]

Magic Heating Box - Magic Thermodynamics Box

Glad to see this stuff on the forum. I retrieved a recent email out of my spam folder over the weekend, and it was from this crowd promoting their wonder product. I had already part-viewed the videos before looking on this site. Videos are amazing - they contain as much non-information as your average party political broadcast. The only thing they lacked was a half-decent actor to give them some air of credibility.
Surprisingly the unsubscribe option on the mail didn't work!

 

[Dan]

Re: Magic Heating Box - Magic Thermodynamics Box

I've edited the title of the thread to remove reference to the wording "Scam" on a solicitors request.
I'm also now working my way through the thread to remove wording in posts such as "Scam" and "Conman" etc.

You could all help keep posts alive by not actually using such wording in the future, and be descriptive as to why any product may or may not work, and why any customer may or may not like it.

Thanks for keeping the forum threads alive by not using such wording within posts.

 

[Keefy]

Re: Magic Heating Box - Magic Thermodynamics Box

I've edited the title of the thread to remove reference to the wording "Scam" on a solicitors request.
I'm also now working my way through the thread to remove wording in posts such as "Scam" and "Conman" etc.

You could all help keep posts alive by not actually using such wording in the future, and be descriptive as to why any product may or may not work, and why any customer may or may not like it.

Thanks for keeping the forum threads alive by not using such wording within posts.

Point noted but half of this thread was asking them for proof of how it worked and they weren't forthcoming. We're still waiting.